EverDrive Forum

General => EverDrive N8 => Topic started by: Necronomfive on September 01, 2015, 04:15 PM

Title: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on September 01, 2015, 04:15 PM
Hello guys,

after some warm-up time now, here is my next Everdrive N8 mapper: Konami VRC7 support.

This is supported by 2 games: the Famicom version of "Tiny Toons 2" and of course "Lagrange Point".

Before everyone gasps now: this initial version supports only the mapper functionality, not the additional FM sound channels... yet. ;-)

So, it is good enough to play the games, but the full sound functionality will take me some time.

Disclaimer: I guarantee no delivery date or schedule for any kind of updates on this mapper. It is done when it is done, and this largely depends on my interest and availability of free time. ;-)

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=01897062818200363928

Installation: unzip the archive, replace "MAPROUT.BIN" in EDFC directory, and copy "085.RBF" to EDFC/MAPS.

Finally: enjoy! ;-)

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: keropi on September 01, 2015, 04:16 PM
excellent! thanks  for sharing!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: aloram on September 01, 2015, 05:28 PM
Thanks for sharing this. Will it support Lagrange Point with the translation patch applied?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: pcfreak324 on September 01, 2015, 10:26 PM
Thanks for sharing this. Will it support Lagrange Point with the translation patch applied?
Yes, just tested it.

Necronomfive, thank you for your great work on the NES mappers.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Blitzed78 on September 02, 2015, 03:44 AM
Thanks!  I appreciate you sharing this. 
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Asaki on September 02, 2015, 02:50 PM
Woah, awesome.

I hate to sound like one of "those guys", but are you considering tackling the MMC5?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: TeamShake on September 02, 2015, 04:45 PM
Great work!  Thanks
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Aether Knight on September 02, 2015, 07:27 PM
I hate to sound like that guy too...but any chance for mapper 037 (Super Mario/Tetris/World Cup) and 105 (Nintendo World Championship) working? Looks like those are the last two Nintendo mappers still unsupported by the N8.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: xamphear on September 03, 2015, 07:39 PM
Hi, in case you don't see my post in the other thread, do you have any way for people to donate money as thanks/incentive for more mappers? Your work is highly appreciated and I'd like to show my appreciation!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Ripthorn on September 03, 2015, 09:42 PM
I have the Lagrange Point, if you need any help to compare the audio between the original cartridge and your everdrive maper, just send the word :)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on September 06, 2015, 12:16 AM
Hi everybody,

thanks for the feedback so far!

I have started to implement first FM functions, but as I indicated, this will take a longer time to develop and debug. I want to make my implementation as close as possible to the real chip.

Since I am leaving now for 2 weeks vacation, my activities will stop during this period.

On a general note: I really appreciate the feedback and gesture, but my activities here are just for my own self-motivated hobby purpose, and I want to keep it this way.

But again: I really appreciate the warm feedback, and it's of course always a nice feeling when something you do for yourself is also useful for other people. ;-)

Best regards,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: bambi on September 07, 2015, 12:22 PM
Really, really cool Necronomfive!

For the purpose on spreading knowledge how to handle implementation of new mappers and custom sound chips, could you possible, if you ever find time for it, write some documentation on the basics? I'm sure it would be a nice read for both me and any other fellow interested developer!

Also, would it be possible for you to host your code under some version control?

Thanks for your great work!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: sdekaar on September 08, 2015, 08:33 PM
thanks Necronomfive you rock! :)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: pelanas on September 09, 2015, 12:04 AM
thanks
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: goombakid on September 09, 2015, 06:47 AM
I haven't got this installed on my card yet, but looks like this post is getting its props.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32wWs2j2S0Q

You think tackling FDS would be possible?

[EDIT] Linked to THIS THREAD (http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=3405.0). If there are any updates to the mapper, please post there.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leoncrise on September 13, 2015, 05:11 AM
Hi everybody,

thanks for the feedback so far!

I have started to implement first FM functions, but as I indicated, this will take a longer time to develop and debug. I want to make my implementation as close as possible to the real chip.

Since I am leaving now for 2 weeks vacation, my activities will stop during this period.

On a general note: I really appreciate the feedback and gesture, but my activities here are just for my own self-motivated hobby purpose, and I want to keep it this way.

But again: I really appreciate the warm feedback, and it's of course always a nice feeling when something you do for yourself is also useful for other people. ;-)

Best regards,

Necronomfive

I don't know how to thank you, tell me your account number, I think I can donate some money for your hard woking!!!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on September 21, 2015, 12:00 AM
Hello all,

I haven't got this installed on my card yet, but looks like this post is getting its props.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32wWs2j2S0Q

Very interesting! I honestly did not anticipate that my mapper would be helpful for this particular use-case.

Anyway, I'm back from my vacation and resumed work on the YM2413 FM implementation, so that anyone will be able to have the extra sound channels.

Again: this is way more complex than Sunsoft 5B audio, so it will take some time.
BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: phoenixdownita on September 21, 2015, 02:10 AM
What not asking kevin to share his ;-)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on September 21, 2015, 02:07 PM
What not asking kevin to share his ;-)

And where is the fun in that? ;-)

Seriously, I always prefer doing my own logic implementions and retain full control over my contributions. The driving force behind my motivation is partly to get the game going, but mostly for my own educational purpose.

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: phoenixdownita on September 22, 2015, 08:39 AM
Just for shit and giggles:

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/242970-fpga-based-videogame-system/
as a reaction to:
http://atariage.com/forums/topic/235430-how-has-this-not-been-posted-yet-retro-vgs/page-60#entry3325199
[you can read all the drama about the retroVGS in that thread but ... as I said just" for shit and giggles"
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on September 25, 2015, 12:47 AM
Hello guys,

after some warm-up time now, here is my next Everdrive N8 mapper: Konami VRC7 support.

This is supported by 2 games: the Famicom version of "Tiny Toons 2" and of course "Lagrange Point".

Before everyone gasps now: this initial version supports only the mapper functionality, not the additional FM sound channels... yet. ;-)

So, it is good enough to play the games, but the full sound functionality will take me some time.

Disclaimer: I guarantee no delivery date or schedule for any kind of updates on this mapper. It is done when it is done, and this largely depends on my interest and availability of free time. ;-)

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=01897062818200363928

Installation: unzip the archive, replace "MAPROUT.BIN" in EDFC directory, and copy "085.RBF" to EDFC/MAPS.

Finally: enjoy! ;-)

BR,

Necronomfive

I think that when I installed the 085.RBF file, it replaced an existing one inside the folder (I'm using the latest os12). The question is, since it replaced a file, will that break any game?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: GreatFunky on September 25, 2015, 09:35 AM
Hello guys,

after some warm-up time now, here is my next Everdrive N8 mapper: Konami VRC7 support.

This is supported by 2 games: the Famicom version of "Tiny Toons 2" and of course "Lagrange Point".

Before everyone gasps now: this initial version supports only the mapper functionality, not the additional FM sound channels... yet. ;-)

So, it is good enough to play the games, but the full sound functionality will take me some time.

Disclaimer: I guarantee no delivery date or schedule for any kind of updates on this mapper. It is done when it is done, and this largely depends on my interest and availability of free time. ;-)

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=01897062818200363928

Installation: unzip the archive, replace "MAPROUT.BIN" in EDFC directory, and copy "085.RBF" to EDFC/MAPS.

Finally: enjoy! ;-)

BR,

Necronomfive

I think that when I installed the 085.RBF file, it replaced an existing one inside the folder (I'm using the latest os12). The question is, since it replaced a file, will that break any game?

Krikzz have updated this mapper in os 12 so it's useless now... until Necronomfive made a new one with the additional FM sound  ;)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on September 25, 2015, 10:02 PM
Hello guys,

after some warm-up time now, here is my next Everdrive N8 mapper: Konami VRC7 support.

This is supported by 2 games: the Famicom version of "Tiny Toons 2" and of course "Lagrange Point".

Before everyone gasps now: this initial version supports only the mapper functionality, not the additional FM sound channels... yet. ;-)

So, it is good enough to play the games, but the full sound functionality will take me some time.

Disclaimer: I guarantee no delivery date or schedule for any kind of updates on this mapper. It is done when it is done, and this largely depends on my interest and availability of free time. ;-)

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=01897062818200363928

Installation: unzip the archive, replace "MAPROUT.BIN" in EDFC directory, and copy "085.RBF" to EDFC/MAPS.

Finally: enjoy! ;-)

BR,

Necronomfive

I think that when I installed the 085.RBF file, it replaced an existing one inside the folder (I'm using the latest os12). The question is, since it replaced a file, will that break any game?

Krikzz have updated this mapper in os 12 so it's useless now... until Necronomfive made a new one with the additional FM sound  ;)

Oh Bummer, all that effort was for naught. Which one works best? or should we wait for the FM sound addition?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: GreatFunky on September 25, 2015, 10:18 PM
Both should work fine , no problem because os12 support natively , you can play lagrange point and wait the next FM improvement
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: goombakid on March 24, 2016, 08:16 PM
Yeah, I'm bumping an old thread.

Seeing if there was an update to this. Otherwise...

I just got around to playing with it today, but I'm not getting any sound out from my N8 with my Twin Fami. Using OS13.  Any help?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: GreatFunky on March 24, 2016, 08:43 PM
I'm still using os12 because os13 was an update for Hi-Def NES HDMI Adapter that i do not have . I have no FM sound but other sounds are working under lagrange point...
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: goombakid on March 25, 2016, 02:55 AM
Ahh, thought the music was working as well. I did get some sound now. Thanks!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: wyatt8740 on March 28, 2016, 06:14 AM
What not asking kevin to share his ;-)
I've asked him - he doesn't want to share it unless he's getting some money for his time.

It'd be very nice, of course, but he's also said in IRC on multiple occasions that he's thinking of making a flash cart. Right now, it seems like he's not, but he's probably wanting to hold onto it just in case.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on March 28, 2016, 12:27 PM
Yeah, it seems a bit crazy to expect full on YM2612 emulation from the N8. Seems like the only option to play the translation of this game with sound on Famicom hardware is the NES HDMI adapter, or the Analogue NT that can also be equipped with it.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: hunterk on March 28, 2016, 04:30 PM
I've asked him - he doesn't want to share it unless he's getting some money for his time.
Did he give any sort of price range for it? I think people here would pretty gladly pitch in on a bounty for working VRC7 audio and fixed FDS audio.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on March 29, 2016, 08:24 PM
I'm willing to either donate to a pool of money to buy it, or even buy him directly the rights to download and use the full mapper. Can anyone talk to him about this?

It could be something like $5 dollars per mapper download.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on April 04, 2016, 08:07 AM
I've asked him - he doesn't want to share it unless he's getting some money for his time.
Did he give any sort of price range for it? I think people here would pretty gladly pitch in on a bounty for working VRC7 audio and fixed FDS audio.
That and proper-sounding VRC6 audio. That was my one biggest disappointment of the N8 I just received this weekend, the poor expansion audio support. I'd rather emulate Akumajou Densetsu than play it through this on my RGB-modded AV Famicom. It didn't take too long to realize I wouldn't be playing FDS games through it either. That distorted sound during the Doki Doki Panic intro was such a letdown.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: hunterk on April 05, 2016, 06:12 PM
That and proper-sounding VRC6 audio.
I'm pretty happy with the audio from VRC6 and Sunsoft 5b community mappers. You can tell some slight differences on each in A/B testing (there are some youtube videos that have sideb-by-side comparisons) but I wouldn't be able to pick out which is which in blind testing.

But yeah, the FDS audio can be pretty rough. I just ordered an FDSStick and FDS ram adapter to get perfect un-emulated audio on FDS games. All in <$60.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: mikejmoffitt on April 18, 2016, 09:30 PM
Until full VRC7 sound emulation is in, it might be easy to throw together something that will at least play some square or sine waves of the appropriate pitch, implementing only the carrier. It would let you at least enjoy the tunes a little bit...
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: goombakid on April 19, 2016, 02:25 AM
I just ordered an FDSStick and FDS ram adapter to get perfect un-emulated audio on FDS games. All in <$60.

Question for you on the FDSStick. Is that 3206 mod needed to use the thing in general (just play a disk game), or is that mod only needed if you want to do something extra with it?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on April 19, 2016, 06:36 AM
I just ordered an FDSStick and FDS ram adapter to get perfect un-emulated audio on FDS games. All in <$60.

Question for you on the FDSStick. Is that 3206 mod needed to use the thing in general (just play a disk game), or is that mod only needed if you want to do something extra with it?

That mod is only necessary if you want to copy images to disks.  If just want to run games off the FDSStick's flash, you don't need any mods.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: goombakid on April 19, 2016, 07:29 AM
That mod is only necessary if you want to copy images to disks.  If just want to run games off the FDSStick's flash, you don't need any mods.

Hmmm...I might have to invest in that then...or maybe even THIS? (http://fdsemu.com/)

...and sorry for derailing the thread.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: hunterk on April 19, 2016, 04:53 PM
I've been playing around with the FDSStick and have been very pleased. The audio is perfect and the menu is really cool (looks just like an FDS BIOS). It also doesn't seem to crash on my rev1 Nt. My only complaint is that the software is Windows-only :(

FDSEmu is very similar in functionality but the menu is more spartan and the software is cross-platform. I believe he just debuted a version that accepts microSD, which is nice, but it still doesn't have a case >_>
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: The_Atomik_Punk! on April 20, 2016, 12:42 AM
I've asked him - he doesn't want to share it unless he's getting some money for his time.
Did he give any sort of price range for it? I think people here would pretty gladly pitch in on a bounty for working VRC7 audio and fixed FDS audio.

Yeah, I've basically purchased all of the famicom games with expansion audio that I wanted to hear with proper audio (Lagrange Point, Gimmik!, Just Breed, Akumajou Densetsu, Esper Dream 2, Madara). It's understandably difficult to emulate such varied mappers accurately, but I don't want to deal with original FDS hardware in order to play FDS games with correct sound, particularly because if you emulate the extra FDS channels accurately, the fix will apply to all games.

If this individual wants to get paid in order to divulge his work that would lead to proper FDS audio, I'd gladly chip in some cash; let's proposition him I say.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: wyatt8740 on May 09, 2016, 05:59 AM
That mod is only necessary if you want to copy images to disks.  If just want to run games off the FDSStick's flash, you don't need any mods.

Hmmm...I might have to invest in that then...or maybe even THIS? (http://fdsemu.com/)

...and sorry for derailing the thread.
Oh, hi there, Moffitt!
You will be very pleased with the fdsemu.

I've asked him - he doesn't want to share it unless he's getting some money for his time.
Did he give any sort of price range for it? I think people here would pretty gladly pitch in on a bounty for working VRC7 audio and fixed FDS audio.
That and proper-sounding VRC6 audio. That was my one biggest disappointment of the N8 I just received this weekend, the poor expansion audio support. I'd rather emulate Akumajou Densetsu than play it through this on my RGB-modded AV Famicom. It didn't take too long to realize I wouldn't be playing FDS games through it either. That distorted sound during the Doki Doki Panic intro was such a letdown.

I got a fdsemu (new and similar to the fdsstick - a friend of mine on nesdev made it). Couldn't be happier with it for that. Still very disappointed with the N8. I mean, there's no comparison with FDS zelda. And it still has bugs that I asked about months (and in one case two years) ago.

Ah well.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Asaki on May 09, 2016, 04:47 PM
I'm surprised only a few people have submitted their own customized mappers. I thought for sure there would be more community support, especially regarding things like MMC5.

It's times like these that I wish I were more proficient in programming.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: wyatt8740 on May 10, 2016, 07:29 AM
Most nesdev-ers who have the knowledge and care enough to write mappers did so on the Powerpak because it came out first. Loopy did a great mapper on the MMC5 on the powerpak (though it's still missing a couple of things, it is far more complete than the N8's).
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: owlnonymous on May 11, 2016, 04:39 PM
I just played Lagrange Point using this mapper on an Analogue NT, and the expansion audio is supported. I can make a video if requested.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: hunterk on May 11, 2016, 06:35 PM
That's only through the HiDefNES' built-in audio chip emulation. It doesn't work with an N8 alone.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Eno on September 13, 2016, 12:31 AM
Can anyone repost?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: GAME1213 on September 13, 2016, 01:32 AM
Can anyone repost?

Here's the file https://mega.nz/#!DkcF1Zrb!MoPQSv6atDPBA13y-qgc2gqz_XhDgmtQGwcPajJIDXc
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Eno on September 14, 2016, 07:02 PM
Getting errors when running both the jap and eng versions of the game.  Is there something else I have to do to get the mappers working on it?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Jive3D on November 06, 2016, 06:21 PM
I just tried it on my Everdrive N8 using OS 14 on the AVS system, both the original J rom and the J rom with the (seemingly) most recent English translation patch just come up as a grey screen...

Is this Maprout.bin & .RBF meant for an earlier firmware than 14?

Before trying these files the English patched rom ran fine on my AVS, but of course without the music...

I *THINK* that the AVS supports the HiDefNES audio (I'm totally new to this, but have tried to read around a bit)... if the sound is supposed to work on the Analogue NT, I *THINK* (hope, really :)) that it should work on the AVS.

Anyone get it working on the AVS?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on November 06, 2016, 07:54 PM
I just tried it on my Everdrive N8 using OS 14 on the AVS system, both the original J rom and the J rom with the (seemingly) most recent English translation patch just come up as a grey screen...

Is this Maprout.bin & .RBF meant for an earlier firmware than 14?

Before trying these files the English patched rom ran fine on my AVS, but of course without the music...

I *THINK* that the AVS supports the HiDefNES audio (I'm totally new to this, but have tried to read around a bit)... if the sound is supposed to work on the Analogue NT, I *THINK* (hope, really :)) that it should work on the AVS.

Anyone get it working on the AVS?

Thanks!

The AVS does not support expansion audio.  The game should work without expansion sound using the stock OS 14 mapper.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Jive3D on November 06, 2016, 10:23 PM
Thanks, Great Hierophant.

Dang, no expansion audio support on the AVS. Thanks for letting me know... so then there might be hope (for this running as it would from an OEM) in the future maybe via some Krikzz programing mastery? Happy to wait, as long as it's not like the wait for Dragon Hopper.

And yes, the game seeming runs great on OS14 outside of the audio...
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on November 06, 2016, 10:24 PM
I just tried it on my Everdrive N8 using OS 14 on the AVS system, both the original J rom and the J rom with the (seemingly) most recent English translation patch just come up as a grey screen...

Is this Maprout.bin & .RBF meant for an earlier firmware than 14?

Before trying these files the English patched rom ran fine on my AVS, but of course without the music...

I *THINK* that the AVS supports the HiDefNES audio (I'm totally new to this, but have tried to read around a bit)... if the sound is supposed to work on the Analogue NT, I *THINK* (hope, really :)) that it should work on the AVS.

Anyone get it working on the AVS?

Thanks!

The AVS does not support expansion audio.  The game should work without expansion sound using the stock OS 14 mapper.

The AVS does support expansion audio if you use a real cartridge, what it will not do is emulate VRC7 sound like the hidefnes does.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on November 07, 2016, 03:12 AM
I just tried it on my Everdrive N8 using OS 14 on the AVS system, both the original J rom and the J rom with the (seemingly) most recent English translation patch just come up as a grey screen...

Is this Maprout.bin & .RBF meant for an earlier firmware than 14?

Before trying these files the English patched rom ran fine on my AVS, but of course without the music...

I *THINK* that the AVS supports the HiDefNES audio (I'm totally new to this, but have tried to read around a bit)... if the sound is supposed to work on the Analogue NT, I *THINK* (hope, really :)) that it should work on the AVS.

Anyone get it working on the AVS?

Thanks!

The AVS does not support expansion audio.  The game should work without expansion sound using the stock OS 14 mapper.

The AVS does support expansion audio if you use a real cartridge, what it will not do is emulate VRC7 sound like the hidefnes does.

I meant to say that the AVS does not support expansion audio like the HiDef NES mod does.  The HiDef NES Mod and the Analogue Nt recreate expansion audio like internal NES audio through its FPGA.  The AVS does not generate expansion sound on its FPGA but will digitize sound produced by a cartridge.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on November 07, 2016, 10:45 AM
So, since the code to simulate the Lagrange Point audio hardware on a FPGA already exists on the HiDefNES thanks to Kevtris, wouldn't it be possible to just use his code for the EDN8?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on November 07, 2016, 03:32 PM
So, since the code to simulate the Lagrange Point audio hardware on a FPGA already exists on the HiDefNES thanks to Kevtris, wouldn't it be possible to just use his code for the EDN8?

Nope. Kevtris has already signed with the analogue nt team, he can't sell or license his code to anyone else.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: MaarioS on November 07, 2016, 09:36 PM
seriuz byznyzmyn
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: sneakernets on November 08, 2016, 12:58 AM
So, since the code to simulate the Lagrange Point audio hardware on a FPGA already exists on the HiDefNES thanks to Kevtris, wouldn't it be possible to just use his code for the EDN8?

Nope. Kevtris has already signed with the analogue nt team, he can't sell or license his code to anyone else.
aaand suddenly I remember why a few AtariAge guys said this was a bad idea. How the hell can they take his source code when they order from him his own HDMI kits? That doesn't give them the right to any of that code - that's not how any industry works. They weren't made for the Analogue specifically, so why do they get dibs?

What a bummer.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: MaarioS on November 08, 2016, 03:15 AM
Any shit like that is absolutely stupid. We are a community that is so small that it's a heaven's bless if anyone produces something like a new remade NES console, Everdrive, adapter device etc. Let alone something hardcore like extra audio implementation that almost no one could achieve.

If any of this happened, it should be distributed open source or at least available to purchase in some way, in device form or software form. Everyone so much appreciates that either way. Seriously, after all that there appear assholes that sign contracts and make each other a competitor like in 1980s in such small community like ours?? Complete bullshit this is just stupid and shove all of those projects anywhere you want in this case. No offense, end of story
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on November 08, 2016, 03:28 AM
So, since the code to simulate the Lagrange Point audio hardware on a FPGA already exists on the HiDefNES thanks to Kevtris, wouldn't it be possible to just use his code for the EDN8?

Nope. Kevtris has already signed with the analogue nt team, he can't sell or license his code to anyone else.
aaand suddenly I remember why a few AtariAge guys said this was a bad idea. How the hell can they take his source code when they order from him his own HDMI kits? That doesn't give them the right to any of that code - that's not how any industry works. They weren't made for the Analogue specifically, so why do they get dibs?

What a bummer.

When money is at stake, stuff like this matters. But don't ask me, Kevtris is not obligated to share any of his work with anyone.

On the other hand, Necronomfive said he was working on VRC7 sound support, and then he dissapeared after some time. Probably Real Lifetm happened to him. Oh well, somebody else will add this at some point. if not, I'll just play lagrange point on an emulator.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on November 10, 2016, 11:28 AM
Honestly, how many more sales of the Analogue NT will happen just because it's the only hardware you can play the English-translated Lagrange Point on when in conjunction with an EDN8 and the patched ROM? If you ask me, I find the withholding of the VRC7 audio code to be quite petty. But it's Kevtris and Analogue's prerogative to do it, so.. welp.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Aether Knight on November 10, 2016, 11:53 AM
Kevtris probably spent many hours perfecting code for the vrc7 expansion sound code so he's entitled to do with it as he pleases. In a free market economy this is how its done. Analogue NT & co. saw this as one of the selling points and more than likely locked down a contract. Kevtris would be a fool to turn it down. However this doesn't mean vrc7 is without reach. I'm sure someone will step up and create an alternate vrc7 option that doesn't step on anyone's toes. That suggestion of hiring a FPGA programmer for x$/hr. looks like a possible solution as well.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on November 11, 2016, 05:29 AM
Kevtris probably spent many hours perfecting code for the vrc7 expansion sound code so he's entitled to do with it as he pleases. In a free market economy this is how its done. Analogue NT & co. saw this as one of the selling points and more than likely locked down a contract. Kevtris would be a fool to turn it down. However this doesn't mean vrc7 is without reach. I'm sure someone will step up and create an alternate vrc7 option that doesn't step on anyone's toes. That suggestion of hiring a FPGA programmer for x$/hr. looks like a possible solution as well.

That might work, Shadow from the PS-IO team hired an FPGA programmer on a contract basis to be able to re-write the firmware for the PS-IO. If we follow his example it might work for us as well; I suggest everyone on this thread donate money to the cause via an indie gogo campaign, or via a patreon account, in order to pay a programmer on a contract basis to make the code for us.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: fys on November 13, 2016, 11:49 PM
Please point me to the source code for Everdrive N8.

Honestly, how many more sales of the Analogue NT will happen just because it's the only hardware you can play the English-translated Lagrange Point on when in conjunction with an EDN8 and the patched ROM? If you ask me, I find the withholding of the VRC7 audio code to be quite petty. But it's Kevtris and Analogue's prerogative to do it, so.. welp.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: zansatsu0 on November 14, 2016, 05:55 AM
Please point me to the source code for Everdrive N8.

http://krikzz.com/pub/support/everdrive-n8/development/ (http://krikzz.com/pub/support/everdrive-n8/development/)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: zansatsu0 on November 14, 2016, 06:28 AM
Also for anyone interested, Kevin has documented his research on the VRC-VII in the link below. All of this information can be had by looking at the source for emulators and doesn't solely depend on Kevin anymore.

http://kevtris.org/nes/vrcvii.txt (http://kevtris.org/nes/vrcvii.txt)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Greg2600 on December 21, 2016, 01:12 AM
I would be completely against ANY firmware development that is not sanctioned by Krikzz.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: mario64 on January 01, 2017, 01:16 AM
I just updated to OS v15 via overwriting my existing files. Everything seems to work fine but I do have a question. This custom mapper requires replacement of MAPROUT.BIN. Thing is, the new OS has a newer version of that file. Given that, is it safe to replace? Interestingly, I still am getting graphics in Lagrange Point using the newer one. No idea why or how though
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on January 01, 2017, 04:49 PM
I just updated to OS v15 via overwriting my existing files. Everything seems to work fine but I do have a question. This custom mapper requires replacement of MAPROUT.BIN. Thing is, the new OS has a newer version of that file. Given that, is it safe to replace? Interestingly, I still am getting graphics in Lagrange Point using the newer one. No idea why or how though

Kkrikz added support for the mapper, just no sound support yet. Not sure what the point of that would be, but it's there anyways.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: mario64 on January 02, 2017, 03:01 AM
Ahh ok cool. Thanks. Didn't realize that
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: infinest on January 03, 2017, 03:46 PM
Kkrikz added support for the mapper, just no sound support yet. Not sure what the point of that would be, but it's there anyways.
People with a Hidef NES kit can play it on their Everdrive with the Audio coming from the Hidef NES kit.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on June 17, 2017, 07:26 PM
 Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Brachabre on June 17, 2017, 10:03 PM
Sweeeeet!  ;D
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 18, 2017, 03:07 AM
Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101

say whaaaaaaaaat? Lets go play some lagrange point madafakas!!!
Thank you necronomfive you are awesome!!!!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 18, 2017, 08:31 AM
Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101

Did it work for you? the game keeps crashing on me a minute after booting.

I'm using an AVS + EDN8 fami version. I tried all of the firmwares available for the AVS. I also tried v14 and v15 EDN8 OS versions, and I also followed the instructions to the letter, including formatting the SD card and defragmenting it. :(
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: sammy555 on June 18, 2017, 09:04 AM
Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101

Did it work for you? the game keeps crashing on me a minute after booting.

I'm using an AVS + EDN8 fami version. I tried all of the firmwares available for the AVS. I also tried v14 and v15 EDN8 OS versions, and I also followed the instructions to the letter, including formatting the SD card and defragmenting it. :(

Ah that sucks for you. Working for me although the music is a little quiet. Hopefully that's fixed.

I'm using AV Famicom with fami n8
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: BarbieOnWeed on June 18, 2017, 10:33 AM
Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101

Did it work for you? the game keeps crashing on me a minute after booting.

I'm using an AVS + EDN8 fami version. I tried all of the firmwares available for the AVS. I also tried v14 and v15 EDN8 OS versions, and I also followed the instructions to the letter, including formatting the SD card and defragmenting it. :(

Same for me. :( Im on famicom with OS v15.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on June 18, 2017, 06:13 PM
Necronomfive has updated his VRC7 mapper to add sound support, get it from here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16101

Did it work for you? the game keeps crashing on me a minute after booting.

I'm using an AVS + EDN8 fami version. I tried all of the firmwares available for the AVS. I also tried v14 and v15 EDN8 OS versions, and I also followed the instructions to the letter, including formatting the SD card and defragmenting it. :(

I would think so : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3tUocZ0AqE&t=130s

I am using OS v15.  I would suggest trying the Japanese ROM with a PRG-ROM CRC of 743387FF if the English Translation is giving you trouble.  My translated ROM has a PRG-ROM CRC of 00F49381. 

One change from the official VRC7 mapper 85 instructions I would suggest is to use the MAPROUT.BIN from the official OS v15 and modify byte $55 to $55 in a hex editor.  This ensures that the more recent mapper support found in OS v15 is maintained while ensuring that mapper 85 is designated for those games that need it.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 18, 2017, 11:57 PM
Finally, I can log in again! ;)

Could anyone having the freeze problem please specify:
 
1. Is the bug deterministic (freeze at the same spot), or random? Does it freeze during the intro, or is it enough to just keep the title screen or sound test running for a certain time?
2. Does my old VRC7 mapper have the same problem on your hardware?

This is actually strange, because, apart from adding my FM core, the mapper and IRQ counter logic is identical to the previous no-sound version.

And the game itself doesn't care whether the FM core is present or not. In fact, there is no way for it to detect the presence of a working FM core at all.

This mapper is, btw, developed on a real AV Famicom. I have no idea how it will react to clone consoles.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 19, 2017, 12:07 AM
Finally, I can log in again! ;)

Could anyone having the freeze problem please specify:
 
1. Is the bug deterministic (freeze at the same spot), or random? Does it freeze during the intro, or is it enough to just keep the title screen or sound test running for a certain time?
2. Does my old VRC7 mapper have the same problem on your hardware?

This is actually strange, because, apart from adding my FM core, the mapper and IRQ counter logic is identical to the previous no-sound version.

And the game itself doesn't care whether the FM core is present or not. In fact, there is no way for it to detect the presence of a working FM core at all.

This mapper is, btw, developed on a real AV Famicom. I have no idea how it will react to clone consoles.

Hi necronomfive.

I suspect this is on the AVS, not on your mapper.

On some firmware versions, the game would crash on the name selection screen, and the graphics would change to a garbled mess. After thorough testing, it went as far as starting the prologue and playing the FM sound.

The old VRC7 mapper worked fine on my AVS, its the new that does not work. OSv14 somehow did not work at all for this game on the AVS while using the new mapper. Whats really sad is I used to have an AV Famicom and I sold it once I got the AVS, because I thought I would never need it.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: BarbieOnWeed on June 19, 2017, 12:27 AM
Finally, I can log in again! ;)

Could anyone having the freeze problem please specify:
 
1. Is the bug deterministic (freeze at the same spot), or random? Does it freeze during the intro, or is it enough to just keep the title screen or sound test running for a certain time?
2. Does my old VRC7 mapper have the same problem on your hardware?

This is actually strange, because, apart from adding my FM core, the mapper and IRQ counter logic is identical to the previous no-sound version.

And the game itself doesn't care whether the FM core is present or not. In fact, there is no way for it to detect the presence of a working FM core at all.

This mapper is, btw, developed on a real AV Famicom. I have no idea how it will react to clone consoles.

1. The game freeze then start to move the player.
2. No. It works.

I Have tried 2 cards. One it freeze then the OS loads up.
On the second one, the game freezes.

Im using a New Famicom, the HVC-101 model.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 19, 2017, 04:51 AM

 I would suggest is to use the MAPROUT.BIN from the official OS v15 and modify byte $55 to $55 in a hex editor. 
modify the byte $55 to $55? Isn't that the same value on both?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on June 19, 2017, 06:38 AM
No, on the official OS v.15, the MAPROUT.BIN byte at $55 is $16.  In other words, $16 tells the EverDrive to use 022.RBF.  $55 tells the EverDrive to use the 085.RBF that Necronomfive added with his VRC7 mapper.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Enmet on June 19, 2017, 03:36 PM
I didn't get it to work at first, but after some hesitation, I decided to defrag the drive as recommended in the readme. And sure enough, it worked!

As for the volume, would it be possible to just turn down the volume on all the other channels instead of increasing it on the VRC7 side? Alternatively, as someone in the nesdev thread mentioned, would an amp mod be possible?

Thank you so much for doing this, I love the music in Lagrange Point!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Sarge on June 20, 2017, 12:08 AM
In the event nothing could be done on the EDN8 side of things, would it be possible to hack the ROM to reduce the volume levels of the other channels?  I'm not sure how much modification that would take, though.

EDIT:  Hmm, forgot that the triangle has no volume control.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 20, 2017, 10:43 PM
Hi,

I have uploaded a new test version:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=00000536350558035973

Changes so far:

- Increased Volume
- Added a missing FM feature which nobody seems to have missed so far... ;-)

@BarbieOnWeed

Could you test whether this version solves your crashing problem?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: sammy555 on June 21, 2017, 12:52 AM
Hi,

I have uploaded a new test version:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=00000536350558035973

Changes so far:

- Increased Volume
- Added a missing FM feature which nobody seems to have missed so far... ;-)

Amazing work! So many great tunes in this game I don't mind being lost.

edit-
my setup:
av famicom
n8 fami OS 15
rom from smokemonster pack
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: BarbieOnWeed on June 21, 2017, 09:58 PM
Hi,

I have uploaded a new test version:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=00000536350558035973

Changes so far:

- Increased Volume
- Added a missing FM feature which nobody seems to have missed so far... ;-)

@BarbieOnWeed

Could you test whether this version solves your crashing problem?
Well, now all the sudden, it works!
All i did was copying the files to the card again. :)

edit: both versions work.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 22, 2017, 12:35 AM
Alright then!  ;)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 24, 2017, 02:28 AM
New release.

- EG note-on trigger improved
- Reduced core size by 13%

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=57390592449091648119
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on June 24, 2017, 03:27 AM
WHAAAAT

Trying this on my AV Fami right away.

UPDATE: the FM Synth channels sound quite accurate, except for their volume level in relation to the built-in Famicom sound channels. The FM Synth channels sound way too quiet. Other than that though, it's well on its way to being an amazing addition to the Everdrive N8. Awesome work!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 25, 2017, 10:28 AM
New release.

- EG note-on trigger improved
- Reduced core size by 13%

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=57390592449091648119

Allow me to thank you once again. Words cannot express my gratitude to you.

It's been so long that I honestly thought something had happened to you, but I'm glad to hear that you're ok, and that you're still interested on this project.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for giving us full VRC7 support.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 25, 2017, 01:50 PM
New release!

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=37264226683392618860

- Finally fixed EG trigger bug. There should be no more skipped notes anymore!

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for giving us full VRC7 support.

No need to thank me.

I'm doing this self-motivated for primarily satisfying my own hobby and interests.

Which (as you all have found out by now), also means that such activity is subject to my own priotitization of my free time. ;)

If somebody else finds it useful, then great, nice to hear that you like it.  :)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 25, 2017, 04:12 PM
No, on the official OS v.15, the MAPROUT.BIN byte at $55 is $16.  In other words, $16 tells the EverDrive to use 022.RBF.  $55 tells the EverDrive to use the 085.RBF that Necronomfive added with his VRC7 mapper.

Hi!

I tried this last night and nothing. Krikkz's mapper has no issues though.

In any case if it works on a real nes, it should work on the AVS, so I'll wait for retroUSB to fix it some day.

Thanks for your help!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on June 25, 2017, 04:13 PM
New release!

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=37264226683392618860

- Finally fixed EG trigger bug. There should be no more skipped notes anymore!

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for giving us full VRC7 support.

No need to thank me.

I'm doing this self-motivated for primarily satisfying my own hobby and interests.

Which (as you all have found out by now), also means that such activity is subject to my own priotitization of my free time. ;)

If somebody else finds it useful, then great, nice to hear that you like it.  :)

you are awesome dude, it was well worth the wait.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: SmokeMonster on June 25, 2017, 10:26 PM
Incredible work, Necronomfive. This is a major accomplishment and I'm very impressed. Thanks for using this project on :D
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 26, 2017, 10:34 PM
New release!

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=31621224785103436729

This time:

- Increased volume again.

In my opinion, the balance between FM & internal APU sound channels should be okay now (at least on the AV Famicom).

Since I have now started to increase the volume by limiting the digital range, on the one hand, the FM sound is now louder, but on the other hand, if more than 4 voices are now played at full envelope volume, the output mixing stage now starts to clip the signal, thus losing dynamic range.

I am not so happy with this solution, but this is the only way to deal with it without redesigning the Everdrive N8 with a proper audio amplifier circuit (hint at krikzz  ;) ).

Most people will still be happy with this anyway.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Sarge on June 27, 2017, 04:04 AM
Awesome work!  Thanks much!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on June 27, 2017, 07:27 AM
New release!

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=31621224785103436729

This time:

- Increased volume again.

In my opinion, the balance between FM & internal APU sound channels should be okay now (at least on the AV Famicom).

Since I have now started to increase the volume by limiting the digital range, on the one hand, the FM sound is now louder, but on the other hand, if more than 4 voices are now played at full envelope volume, the output mixing stage now starts to clip the signal, thus losing dynamic range.

I am not so happy with this solution, but this is the only way to deal with it without redesigning the Everdrive N8 with a proper audio amplifier circuit (hint at krikzz  ;) ).

Most people will still be happy with this anyway.

A fair assessment.  I cranked up the volume a bit louder than for other games and it sounded much better than before. 

Now can you do anything about the encounter rate?  ;D
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Asbrandt on June 27, 2017, 09:12 AM
I have my expansion audio mixer switch configured so that the "Everdrive" setting is volume tuned for what I believe to be the latest version of your own Sunsoft 5B mapper (September 6th 2015) which also matches the VRC6 replacement mapper, a version set to 75% volume.

And I'm pleased to report that the volume of your latest version is spot-on with this configuration when compared against the real Lagrange Point cartridge on my appropriate mixer setting for real cartridges.

The real cartridge has a noticable low-pass-filter, but that isn't something that could be accommodated via the FPGA, it would have to be done in a modification to the mixer.

EDIT: The potential for clipping is unfortunate, if you wanted to re-tune the volume of both this and the 5B for a lower volume I'm sure there would be a version of the VRC6 that matches and a change to the mixer configuration. (I use Viletim's recommended configuration with the NESRGB)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on June 27, 2017, 10:58 AM
I just ran the new mapper on my NESRGB-modded AV Famicom.. The 2A03 channels still sound a bit on the hot side, but it's close enough for my liking. I also have an Akumajou Densetsu cart that sounds perfect and damn close to the aforementioned 75% VRC6 mapper, so I know the expansion audio is running properly on my console, but I do not have a Lagrange Point cart to run for comparison. Still, it's close enough to how Nestopia sounds that I'm happy with it. Thanks again!

BTW: I couldn't care less about the clipping potential, I'll risk that in order to get a better mix.

PS: I just did some tests... Did some A/B comparisons on my AV Famicom and Nestopia through the latest Retroarch:

• VRC6 75_70 mapper on the EDN8 and the Akumajou Densetsu cart, and Nestopia damn near identical.
• Latest Sunsoft 5B mapper with Gimmick! on the EDN8 compared with Nestopia, more or less identical.
• Latest VRC7 mapper compared between EDN8 and Nestopia, 2A03 channels sound significantly hotter on the AV Famicom with the EDN8 than in Nestopia. Can really tell with the PCM kick & snare drums, they pop out a hell of a lot more on the AV Famicom than in Nestopia.

I'm being incredibly nitpicky here, but those are my findings.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Asbrandt on June 27, 2017, 07:27 PM
I'm not keen on using an emulator as a reference point, I generally use Rainwarriors classic-Famicom (AV Mod is well after the mixer components) recordings found HERE (https://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?t=8639) which I use as a reference for my "real cartridge" mixer setting.

That said you aren't wrong that the 2A03 drums stick out more; I did my tests by recording a section then A/Bing in Audacity, I can pretty confidently say that the 'overall' volume level feels correct, but the lack of filtering on the FM Synth means that the tones that line up to the drums aren't quite as loud as they are on the real cartridge, so the drums stick out more.

Adding the filter would indeed require a further volume boost to maintain the 'overall' volume level match unless you used an 'active' filter with properly dialed in gain.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on June 27, 2017, 09:29 PM
I'm not keen on it either, which is why I have the Akumajou Densetsu cart in my AV Fami as a control in my tests. Like i pointed out, the VRC6 mapper is basically identical between the EDN8, Nestopia, and the cart for me.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on June 28, 2017, 08:55 AM
After some further testing of this mapper, I think I may have figured out why the drums are sticking out so much. Whatever channel in the VRC7 that's used for bass in a lot of the music cues in Lagrange Point is exceptionally low. Like REALLY low. It's tougher to notice with a small speaker on a PVM, but once I hooked my console up to my big system I spotted it right away. The music cue where it stands out the most for me is this one:

https://youtu.be/drwX7MbB_IE?t=13m35s

(skip to 13:35 if it doesn't do it automatically)

The bass on here is very easy to hear. It's nice and full and you can almost feel it. It's almost nonexistent with this mapper.

If it's any help, I do believe there are two synth channels being used to create the bass tone in this and a few other cues; one for the high end of it and another for the low end.

I believe that if this is remedied, the drums won't be sticking out as much as a result.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on June 28, 2017, 01:45 PM
https://youtu.be/drwX7MbB_IE?t=13m35s

(skip to 13:35 if it doesn't do it automatically)

The bass on here is very easy to hear. It's nice and full and you can almost feel it. It's almost nonexistent with this mapper.

Careful. This youtube user has lots of videogame soundtracks which have been processed quite heavily (even adding a chorus/hall effect in many of his earlier videos). I don't even have to put on my headphones on to notice right away that he applied quite some heavy EQ and compression on this soundtrack aswell.

Raw, clean recordings from real hardware should always be the reference.

That being said, the internal digital processing of my core is build to exactly match the digital precision (or let's say: lack of precision ;) ) of the VRC7 / YM2413.

Where my mapper starts to differ is the digital mixing and the analogue output stage.

I perform digital mixing, and output the final waveform using a 11-bit Sigma-Delta DAC running at 50MHz.

The original chip has a 9-bit discrete DAC, and each channel is output sequentially by using time division multiplexing. So there is already lots of room for various kinds of signal distortions.

Add to that the differences in filtering circuits between both cartridges.

So it is no surprise that my mapper might sound more crispy, cleaner, colder, and less bassy on the Everdrive N8 than the original cartridge.

It's the same discussion being held in different areas (popular topic in synthesizer gear discussions: my Yamaha DX-7 MK-I sounds way more bassy and warm compared to the "ice cold" Yamaha DX7-MK II).

I personally have no plans to add digital post processing in the FPGA to emulate the "grittiness" of the original audio output.

This is clearly out of scope for this kind of project.

But thank you very much for your positive feedback so far!  :)

Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on June 28, 2017, 04:37 PM
I'm not using just the youtube video as a reference, that's merely the only one I could link to you. And this specific cue (and entire soundtrack) doesn't have anywhere near the same amount of post processing as the other videos on that account (almost none). I have no recording of the original cart to share with you but the difference in the overall level (not crispiness, cleanliness, or some other intangible subtlety) of the channel being used for bass tones is so egregious that it has to be a legit mixing issue. I work as a sound engineer in post-production for feature films myself, so I'd like to think my professional background would give my findings just a little bit of legitimacy. If you have a Lagrange Point cart available to you, try the comparison yourself.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on July 01, 2017, 05:33 AM
After scouring the interwebs, I found some authentic, unprocessed recordings of Lagrange Point audio from an AV Famicom provided by rainwarrior at NESDEV:

http://rainwarrior.ca/projects/nes/lagrange_point_ref.zip

As some of you may know, you can do a sound test of the game by holding A+B on controller 2 while resetting the game.

Even with the latest version, as I said before, the bass channel is significantly lower in volume than it should be in this mapper. The perfect scenario would be to raise the bass channel and lower the PCM drums, although I'm sure it's not that easy, since Necronomfive did mention getting clipping with the mix as it currently is.

Here's the NESDEV thread from where those recordings I posted originate:

http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8639
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on July 01, 2017, 04:46 PM
Even with the latest version, as I said before, the bass channel is significantly lower in volume than it should be in this mapper.

Firstly, thanks for hunting down those recordings.

I did an A/B comparison using my headphones.

While I agree that there is a slight difference in this particular patch (I used the same track as a reference you posted in the youtube video), my personal impression is that the difference is not nearly big enough to call it "significantly".

What I can also confirm again (which is what Asbrandt has been claiming) is the lack of low-pass filtering on my FPGA implementation. For example, the bell-like instrument sounds way sharper on my core.

What I do also hear in the original HW recording is a significantly "dryer" bass reproduction, compared to the youtube video you posted.

I therefore stand by my claim that the youtube video has been "enhanced" a lot by applying EQ. Using headphones, I can easily spot an additional chorus effect.

Just to show you what a bad idea it is to reference non-HW recordings:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_2wm6IzavA&index=8&list=PL2917FA48A56DB74C

Quote
The perfect scenario would be to raise the bass channel and lower the PCM drums, although I'm sure it's not that easy, since Necronomfive did mention getting clipping with the mix as it currently is.

You seem to completely ignore 2 important statements from my previous post, so let me reiterate them:

1. I never ever did claim that my mapper sounds 100% identical to the original HW. I even acknowledged Asbrandt's observation that the high frequency filtering is absent on the Everdrive N8 (crispy sound).

2. The difference in the bass reproduction CAN actually be attributed to the difference in HW mixing between the FPGA<>VRC7, and how the signal is further processed in the analogue domain on the Everdrive N8.

I already made a clear statement regarding this: I won't be adding any kind of EQ processing in the FPGA to countermeasure the difference in the analogue sound reproduction. All my concern is that the digital model closely resembles the real VRC7 / YM2413.

In this regard, the only point which can still be improved are the parameters for the instrument rom (which have been, so far, reverse engineered by ear). But this issue also affects the implementation on the emulators. To get all parameters correctly, the VRC7 needs to be decapped.

Just one last point:

Quote
I work as a sound engineer in post-production for feature films myself, so I'd like to think my professional background would give my findings just a little bit of legitimacy

Frankly, I don't give a hoot about any attempts at argumentum ad verecundiam.

In my POV, regarding this topic, you'd gain more credibility if you would have created some music tracks on Yamaha FM HW before. Or did some VRC7 / Yamaha FM programming / reverse engineering.

Then, your point / argumentation would have looked quite differently right from the start.

I appreciate all kind of bug reports, but this here is clearly out of scope for this project, since it's not even a bug.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Asbrandt on July 04, 2017, 01:31 AM
Looking at the spectrum plots for my test recordings of the FM-only intro sequence on Everdrive vs real cartridge, it appears as though the Everdrive's analog audio output has a notch in the 600hz to 2.4khz range, possibly centered on ~1.2khz but I can't be sure, theres some inconsistencies in the level relationship.

The volumes are identical below this range and consistent with the real VRC7's ~2.28khz low-pass filter above this range, but inside that 600hz to 2khz range the real cartridge is louder and I strongly doubt it's an error in the digital implementation of the VRC7, but rather something introduced in the analog areas of the Everdrive itself.

Although because I no longer own a real cartridge of Akumajou Densetsu and the Everdrive cannot run Just Breed, I cannot confirm if this notch is present in other games.

EDIT: Unrelated, but you mentioned mixing channels being involved in the potential for peaking, could you use time-division multiplexing instead, as that's what I've been told that the real VRC7 and YM2413 that it's based on use?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on July 13, 2017, 10:40 PM
Hi Necronomfive.

Brian Parker from retroUSB had this to say:

"VRC7 is likely the same problem that the initial everdrive mappers had and must be fixed on that end.  They were using poor FPGA design which couldn't handle the variable clock needed for HDMI systems.  Changing the bus timing to fix one version would break another.  That is why it changed with every beta firmware."

Which means I'm fucked. Oh well.

If it works on real hardware, it should work on the AVS, but what can you do.

I was thinking perhaps you'd be willing to share your mapper source with Krikzz to see if he can integrate it to the main everdrive FW release, and maybe fix this.

Would you be willing to open source your VRC7?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: arkanoid-player on July 16, 2017, 05:13 PM
After scouring the interwebs, I found some authentic, unprocessed recordings of Lagrange Point audio from an AV Famicom provided by rainwarrior at NESDEV:

http://rainwarrior.ca/projects/nes/lagrange_point_ref.zip

These recordings are quite noisy. Perhaps because of bad sound card or something. If you want, I could do better recording straight from my Famicom AV (I own the original game in CIB ;D )
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: relic on July 28, 2017, 06:00 AM
I'd like to point out that the AV Famicom has imbalanced expansion audio mixing, it is too loud compared to the 2A03 audio. This affects all expansion audio games, not just Lagrange Point. You guys should be using an original Famicom or Twin Famicom for testing, those consoles have correct audio balance.

At the very least, could we get an alternate package for the original Famicom?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on July 28, 2017, 06:47 AM
The AV Fami does have a different 2A03/Expansion balance than the OG console, but what is being compared is the EDN8 vs the cart on the same console. The VRC6 75_70 mapper is super close to the Akumajou Densetsu cart. VRC7, not so much.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on July 28, 2017, 07:33 AM
Saying that the AV Famicom has audio balance issues is a gross oversimplification, later revisions of the original Famicom PCBs also have similar audio levels to the AV Famicom.  Sharp Famicoms are so nasty in their audio that they shouldn't be used to compare anything : http://en.nicovideo.geo.jp/?sm16346242

Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: polyh3dron on July 28, 2017, 07:35 AM
Saying that the AV Famicom has audio balance issues is a gross oversimplification, later revisions of the original Famicom PCBs also have similar audio levels to the AV Famicom.  Sharp Famicoms are so nasty in their audio that they shouldn't be used to compare anything : http://en.nicovideo.geo.jp/?sm16346242
Yes, the balance issues inherent to those console models are significant and well documented, but said issues are constant when comparing between the cart and the EDN8, are they not?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: relic on July 28, 2017, 05:23 PM
Great Heirophant, have you ever actually listened to an expansion audio game on a Famicom and then an AV Famicom? I have, the audio imbalance on the AV Famicom is bad. It makes the drums in Lagrange Point almost inaudible and games like Akumajo Densetsu sound really off without the 2A03.

The problem I'm trying to point out is it's horribly misguided to be using the AV Famicom as a audio balance reference point. The white and red Famicom is the original Famicom and should be used instead, if only because you can evenly hear the 2A03 and expansion audio, instead of one being too loud and the other too faint. Ideally, the VRC7 package should be fixed to increase the expansion audio in Lagrange Point, but at minimum an alternate "OG Famicom" package would be appreciated.

I tried the EDN8 VRC7 package on my white & red Famicom and the audio is like the opposite of the AV Famicom, the expansion audio is too faint and the 2A03 is too loud. You end up hearing mostly the drums with the FM in the distance.

Oh, forgot to mention something. There's two main versions of the white and red Famicom. One of them has a "FF" logo on the front panel (stands for Famicom Family), these consoles share the audio imbalance of the AV Famicom and have an updated motherboard. The white and red Famicom lacking the FF logo on the front is the true original, it has numerous revisions but they all have correct audio balancing.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on July 29, 2017, 03:17 AM
Great Heirophant, have you ever actually listened to an expansion audio game on a Famicom and then an AV Famicom? I have, the audio imbalance on the AV Famicom is bad. It makes the drums in Lagrange Point almost inaudible and games like Akumajo Densetsu sound really off without the 2A03.

The problem I'm trying to point out is it's horribly misguided to be using the AV Famicom as a audio balance reference point. The white and red Famicom is the original Famicom and should be used instead, if only because you can evenly hear the 2A03 and expansion audio, instead of one being too loud and the other too faint. Ideally, the VRC7 package should be fixed to increase the expansion audio in Lagrange Point, but at minimum an alternate "OG Famicom" package would be appreciated.

I tried the EDN8 VRC7 package on my white & red Famicom and the audio is like the opposite of the AV Famicom, the expansion audio is too faint and the 2A03 is too loud. You end up hearing mostly the drums with the FM in the distance.

Oh, forgot to mention something. There's two main versions of the white and red Famicom. One of them has a "FF" logo on the front panel (stands for Famicom Family), these consoles share the audio imbalance of the AV Famicom and have an updated motherboard. The white and red Famicom lacking the FF logo on the front is the true original, it has numerous revisions but they all have correct audio balancing.

I have listened to expansion sound on a non-FF red and white Famicom, and I agree the sound levels are probably the most balanced on it.  These recording were made with a non-FF AV-modded Famicom : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8639

I hope to make some recordings myself when I get a Lagrange Point cartridge someday soon.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: relic on July 29, 2017, 03:31 AM
I have an English translated Lagrange Point cart, want me to do recordings on my non-FF Famicom and AV Famicom?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 06, 2017, 11:45 PM
Hi,

I added a new vesion here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=99413940728209525032

Regarding VRC7 FM support, this version fixes an inaccuracy with the evelope generator for modulator operators.

...meaning the sound core is more accurate now. ;)

Of course, the biggest change is not for gamers, but for actual developers, who still want to make things for original HW:

The core is not a VRC7 anymore,but a full Yamaha YM2413!

That's right, you now get the complete package!

-> 9 channels of FM sound!
-> 5 rhythm channels!

And even more:

-> Core can be switched between VRC7 and YM2413 instrument ROMs! (set / erase bit 6 of $E000)

This is for makers.

BR,

Necronomfive


Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on August 07, 2017, 03:48 AM
Hi,

I added a new vesion here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=99413940728209525032

Regarding VRC7 FM support, this version fixes an inaccuracy with the evelope generator for modulator operators.

...meaning the sound core is more accurate now. ;)

Of course, the biggest change is not for gamers, but for actual developers, who still want to make things for original HW:

The core is not a VRC7 anymore,but a full Yamaha YM2413!

That's right, you now get the complete package!

-> 9 channels of FM sound!
-> 5 rhythm channels!

And even more:

-> Core can be switched between VRC7 and YM2413 instrument ROMs! (set / erase bit 6 of $E000)

This is for makers.

BR,

Necronomfive

AWESOMEEEEEEEEEEE!!!

it might work with the AVS now, I'll give it a try tonight.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Jegriva on August 07, 2017, 04:13 AM
Hi,

I added a new vesion here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=99413940728209525032

Regarding VRC7 FM support, this version fixes an inaccuracy with the evelope generator for modulator operators.

...meaning the sound core is more accurate now. ;)

Of course, the biggest change is not for gamers, but for actual developers, who still want to make things for original HW:

The core is not a VRC7 anymore,but a full Yamaha YM2413!

That's right, you now get the complete package!

-> 9 channels of FM sound!
-> 5 rhythm channels!

And even more:

-> Core can be switched between VRC7 and YM2413 instrument ROMs! (set / erase bit 6 of $E000)

This is for makers.

BR,

Necronomfive

Who would had thought this was even possible! Great job! My Lagrange Point game will only get better.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: leonquest on August 07, 2017, 07:55 AM
Hi,

I added a new vesion here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=99413940728209525032

Regarding VRC7 FM support, this version fixes an inaccuracy with the evelope generator for modulator operators.

...meaning the sound core is more accurate now. ;)

Of course, the biggest change is not for gamers, but for actual developers, who still want to make things for original HW:

The core is not a VRC7 anymore,but a full Yamaha YM2413!

That's right, you now get the complete package!

-> 9 channels of FM sound!
-> 5 rhythm channels!

And even more:

-> Core can be switched between VRC7 and YM2413 instrument ROMs! (set / erase bit 6 of $E000)

This is for makers.

BR,

Necronomfive

UPDATE: it works perfectly on the AVS now, which happens to have a expansion chip volume slider, so no disparity between SFX and music fot me.

Once again I thank you a billion times, you are a god amongst men. Now 100% of my elite nes collection of the best 400+ NES games work on the everdrive + AVS combo. Suck on that NT Mini.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 07, 2017, 11:41 PM
Who would had thought this was even possible! Great job! My Lagrange Point game will only get better.

Are you developing a new game?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: SquallDark on August 08, 2017, 07:24 AM
Hi. It is necessary that the console have an audio expansion chip to make work this mapper?, I was testing this in a PAL Frontloader NES and others clones but the only thing that takes to reproduce of the music are drums, so I guess so, it will be necessary, right?. See ya.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 09, 2017, 12:52 AM
Hi. It is necessary that the console have an audio expansion chip to make work this mapper?, I was testing this in a PAL Frontloader NES and others clones but the only thing that takes to reproduce of the music are drums, so I guess so, it will be necessary, right?. See ya.

NES consoles do not support expansion audio. They need to be modified.

On top of that, A PAL NES runs both with wrong speed (50Hz vs. 60Hz) and pitch (1.66MHz audio clock vs. 1.79MHz).

Hence, before spending the effort to modify your PAL NES, in order to hear a horribly wrong soundtrack, I recommend to do the same thing as I did: get an AV Famicom. ;-)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: SquallDark on August 09, 2017, 02:39 AM
Hi.

Hi. It is necessary that the console have an audio expansion chip to make work this mapper?, I was testing this in a PAL Frontloader NES and others clones but the only thing that takes to reproduce of the music are drums, so I guess so, it will be necessary, right?. See ya.

NES consoles do not support expansion audio. They need to be modified.

On top of that, A PAL NES runs both with wrong speed (50Hz vs. 60Hz) and pitch (1.66MHz audio clock vs. 1.79MHz).

Hence, before spending the effort to modify your PAL NES, in order to hear a horribly wrong soundtrack, I recommend to do the same thing as I did: get an AV Famicom. ;-)

The question was because I did not know if Lagrange Point really needed expansion, I have no intention on play it in my PAL system, I know the M/Hz differences this was just for testing purpose.

And for my NTSC NOAC clones I have to see if I can get expansion audio from both 54-55 pins. Thanks for your work and answer, really appreciate. See ya.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: GadgetUK on August 09, 2017, 08:41 PM
Great work =D  Awesome job!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 15, 2017, 06:22 AM
MAPROUT.BIN is missing from the latest archive. Your modified version is still necessary though, correct?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 15, 2017, 03:13 PM
MAPROUT.BIN is missing from the latest archive. Your modified version is still necessary though, correct?

Yes, I forgot to include it. Please use the MAPROUT.BIN from one of the archives I previously posted here.

I'm preparing a new version which includes the latest changes from the Mega Everdrive version.

Of course, the only real audience for such an updated core are developers, who actually want to do something on their own with the mapper.

Lagrange Point doesn't care about YM2413 functionality. ;-)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: steve1515 on August 15, 2017, 05:25 PM
The MAPROUT.BIN from your last package includes more modifications than just the one for VRC7.

I took a look and am helping SmokeMonster out. I found the following mods from the default MAPROUT.BIN that Krikzz provides with OS v16:

Mapper#: KrikzzRBF -> NewRBF
----------------------------------------
31: 02 -> FF (2 -> 255)
85: 16 -> 55 (22 -> 85)
137: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
138: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
139: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
141: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
147: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
168: 02 -> FF (2 -> 255)

it looks like Mapper 85 is changed correctly, but what about all that other stuff? Is that needed?
It looks like mappers 31, 137, 138, 139, 141, 147, and 168 may have been modified by mistake.

I'm not sure if all these changes should stay or not. Can you please advise?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on August 16, 2017, 09:25 AM
The MAPROUT.BIN from your last package includes more modifications than just the one for VRC7.

I took a look and am helping SmokeMonster out. I found the following mods from the default MAPROUT.BIN that Krikzz provides with OS v16:

Mapper#: KrikzzRBF -> NewRBF
----------------------------------------
31: 02 -> FF (2 -> 255)
85: 16 -> 55 (22 -> 85)
137: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
138: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
139: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
141: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
147: BA -> FF (186 -> 255)
168: 02 -> FF (2 -> 255)

it looks like Mapper 85 is changed correctly, but what about all that other stuff? Is that needed?
It looks like mappers 31, 137, 138, 139, 141, 147, and 168 may have been modified by mistake.

I'm not sure if all these changes should stay or not. Can you please advise?

Thanks!

Perhaps the blog entry here would help to answer your question : http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.com/2016/03/nes-powerpak-and-everdrive-n8-mapper.html
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 16, 2017, 11:13 PM
Hello,

only the assignment for Mapper 85 needs to be changed.

Since I consider my VRC7 implementation pretty much as complete, I just have given krikzz the full source RTL code.

Now he can make a new official OS update, which includes both my Sunsoft 5B and VRC7 mappers.

Hopefully, this will end now all confusion regarding the usage of my mappers.  ;)

In reality, the core could still be further pushed towards perfection, but I guess this is only possible once somebody decides to decap the VRC7, and extract the correct instrument ROM data.

Again, thanks for the positive feedback. It was a nice challenge "cracking" the most complex Famicom / NES sound mapper.  ;)

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Arnold101 on August 17, 2017, 08:10 PM
hi can you even fix the bad fds sound on the edn8?  :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0EY_k40IEk
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Arnold101 on August 18, 2017, 03:16 AM
Hello,

only the assignment for Mapper 85 needs to be changed.

Since I consider my VRC7 implementation pretty much as complete, I just have given krikzz the full source RTL code.

Now he can make a new official OS update, which includes both my Sunsoft 5B and VRC7 mappers.

Hopefully, this will end now all confusion regarding the usage of my mappers.  ;)

In reality, the core could still be further pushed towards perfection, but I guess this is only possible once somebody decides to decap the VRC7, and extract the correct instrument ROM data.

Again, thanks for the positive feedback. It was a nice challenge "cracking" the most complex Famicom / NES sound mapper.  ;)

BR,

Necronomfive
wich games support Sunsoft 5B?

Anyway i tried lagrange point and is normal that sound volume is a bit low? or is the everdrive sound low on exp sound? i have it already on HI

and that the scrolling at the borders of the screen is not "perfect" is that normal or not?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 18, 2017, 04:44 AM
wich games support Sunsoft 5B?
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22sunsoft+5b%22+games
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Arnold101 on August 18, 2017, 05:32 PM
gimmick sound is very high instead lagrange is low, why?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Great Hierophant on August 23, 2017, 08:43 PM
If anyone wants to compare the real cartridge to the latest mapper, watch this : https://youtu.be/vq34krVOv1Q
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Necronomfive on August 24, 2017, 12:52 AM
If anyone wants to compare the real cartridge to the latest mapper, watch this : https://youtu.be/vq34krVOv1Q

Thanks for the video, and the nice introductory text.  :)

Interesting to hear that the real cartridge generates more background noise than the Everdrive N8.

In general, my core sounds quite similar. But if you listen closely, you can hear the differences.

But, even if somebody will provide accurate die shots of the VRC7, from which the instrument data can be perfectly retrieved, my core would still not sound 100% the same as the real chip due to the aforementioned differences in mixing and analogue sound reproduction.

Granted, if such data will be available some day, of course I will update the core accordingly.

Quote
gimmick sound is very high instead lagrange is low, why?

3 kids may individually shout much louder in a room than 9 kids, without waking their parents. In addition, the 9 kids also have a much softer and more distinguished voice than the 3 kids, which have raspy voices (probably from a cold).

Think about it. ;)
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: iwasaperson on August 24, 2017, 11:50 PM
Would be nice if all the expansion audio cores had the same volume level (high or low), so I could adjust my POT in my NES accordingly one time for all games.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: nuu on August 29, 2017, 03:59 PM
Would be nice if they had the same volume level as the real cart has, so we don't have to adjust any POT and it would work in a Famicom like intended.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: FBX on September 03, 2017, 03:16 PM
Would be nice if they had the same volume level as the real cart has, so we don't have to adjust any POT and it would work in a Famicom like intended.

I'm guessing that would require a lot of work. Right now, Krikzz decided to do away with the "Hi and "Low" volume settings and just default to "Hi". With that, I took Slamy's 100% volume level VRC6 mapper and wired up my own mixing mod based on it to my NESRGB-modded front-loader NES, Here's a schematic of how I wired it to the audio output of the NESRGB:

(http://www.firebrandx.com/downloads/sitepics/EN8%20Slamy%20Mix.png)

Now that again is only based on Slamy's 100% volume VRC6 mapper. Obviously a more flexible solution would be to use a pot in place of the resistors, and also you have to mark 'sweet spots' on the dial for any given expansion audio type.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: nuu on September 07, 2017, 02:05 PM
But the Famicom is the only standard reference there is, and existing game carts are already designed around it. I don't see the point in inventing a new standard for the Everdrive that is incompatible with existing expansion audio game cartridges.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: iwasaperson on September 08, 2017, 03:27 AM
But the Famicom is the only standard reference there is, and existing game carts are already designed around it. I don't see the point in inventing a new standard for the Everdrive that is incompatible with existing expansion audio game cartridges.
I do not believe the EDN8 can be as loud as a real cartridge without modification of the hardware (similar to upgrading the SD2SNES to Rev H) or a new revision entirely.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: nuu on September 09, 2017, 01:50 AM
OK so it's a design fault of the EDN8. Could be a thing to consider for Krikzz if he ever makes a new N8.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Kwyjibo on March 17, 2018, 10:45 AM
Dead link :(
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: gamesfromthegrave on March 20, 2018, 06:48 AM
Dead link :(

Yeah, this has me crying like a little baby. I have a RetroUSB AVS and was so happy to see this. I need that last custom mapper and the MAPROUT.BIN. Can anyone help us out?
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: James-F on March 20, 2018, 07:49 AM
Individual N8 Mapper Updates (unofficial)...
http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=3405.0

Go to the main Mapper thread and on the 3rd page you will find my Mediafire link will all the fixed mappers.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: nensondubois on April 19, 2019, 12:19 AM
Now that the 100% accurate tonesets have been dumped, maybe create an update for the for the mapper to reflect the new information?

https://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9141&start=15
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: fernan1234 on May 17, 2020, 05:09 AM
Sorry if this is an unwarranted necro-bump for this topic. I'm just really curious whether the current VRC7 core used in the current N8 OS is still the last one that Necronomfive worked on, or if it has had any further updates. At least on the Famicom N8 Pro with the op-amp, the sound is outstandingly close to the real cartridge compared to how it was on the OG N8 the last time I checked. I don't know if this is purely due to the op-amp or something else, especially after a die shot of the chip became available.
Title: Re: Konami VRC7 Mapper Support Package
Post by: Enmet on July 10, 2020, 03:02 AM
I'm just really curious whether the current VRC7 core used in the current N8 OS is still the last one that Necronomfive worked on, or if it has had any further updates.

It probably is, I had a look around here and on nesdev and the last update I could find was from 2017, while the patch set was dumped in 2019. The changelog for the original N8 mentions that the audio core was added, while the Pro changelog has no specific mention of the mapper.

Now that the 100% accurate tonesets have been dumped, maybe create an update for the for the mapper to reflect the new information?

https://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9141&start=15

Does anyone have an update on this?