Author Topic: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?  (Read 625 times)

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Offline samenute

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What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« on: September 08, 2021, 04:30 AM »
I found an option to turn on save states in a menu, but even with it turned on, I pressed start+up and start+down a hundred times in five different games and never once did anything happen.  Is there something else I have to do to make them work?  I've been wondering if maybe a folder needs to be created for them on the SD card. 

Also, is there a manual somewhere for the Everdrive?  This is a question I'd go to a manual for, but I can't find one.

Online nuu

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2021, 01:52 PM »
Not for the original N8 but the Pro has a manual: http://krikzz.com/pub/support/everdrive-n8/

Offline samenute

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2021, 07:55 PM »
Well, that manual does mention a SNAP folder, but looking at the SD card, I see that the folder is already there, so it's not that.

Offline lee4

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2021, 08:32 PM »
are you using real nes or clone nes ?
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Offline samenute

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2021, 09:50 PM »
Quote
are you using real nes or clone nes ?

It's an FC Dual.  I'd wondered if it might be a problem with it being a clone, but the cartridge otherwise seems to work correctly.  Also, it wrote an SRAM save file for a game that I don't even have on my SD card, which indicates that someone played that game before I got the cartridge, and that's making me wonder if it wasn't already returned to Amazon once before because of this problem.

...but, I don't know.  No one seems to be able to tell me for sure that I'm even doing everything that I need to do in order to use save states.  So, for all I know, they actually work just fine and I'm simply missing a step that's required to use them.

I'm going to try downloading older versions of the OS and see if any of them work differently.

Offline lee4

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2021, 09:57 PM »
NOC ASIC NES Clones do not support save states feature

only legitimate Real NES or FPGA NES support save states feature
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Offline samenute

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2021, 12:01 AM »
Quote
NOC ASIC NES Clones do not support save states feature

only legitimate Real NES or FPGA NES support save states feature

Are you sure about that?  I can't figure out what NOC means in relation to ASIC, other than "network on chip" which wouldn't be relevant here, nor do I know why the cartridge should care whether the NES is implemented in ASIC or FPGA, as they're just different ways to accomplish the same end goals.  How it is implemented should be far more relevant than the technology used to implement it.

However, I am leaning towards this being a problem with this particular clone.  I had a look at the pinout for an NES cartridge and, given that there's no feed-through for controller input or anything like that, I can only guess that the N8 works by watching what the CPU is doing and noticing when it reads the controller registers and receives data that says that one of the relevant button pairs is pressed, at which point it starts feeding the cartridge its own string of instructions rather than what's actually in the game's ROM.  So then, while contemplating whether I cared enough to attach a signal analyzer and see if that's what is actually going on, I took the console apart and saw that the entire NES is implemented in a single chip under an epoxy blob.  Of course, by itself, that doesn't necessarily mean anything, it all depends on how it's implemented.  However, it's easy to imagine that since the entire system is implemented on a single chip, that when it comes to reading the controller ports, the address and/or data never ends up on the I/O lines that connect to the cartridge, and therefore the N8 can't detect it.  Of course, this is just a guess as to how it might work, or not work in this case.

I guess I'll ask around and see if anyone has an original NES console that I can test the cartridge in.  Short of someone showing up who has an FC Dual and can tell me whether save states work for them, or someone telling me about another undocumented options menu where save states are disabled by default, I don't think I'm going to figure out anything definitive from this thread. 

Online nuu

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2021, 11:33 AM »
It was a typo as it should by NOAC (Nes-On-A-Chip). But you are right that it depends on the particular clone. The NOAC clones all derive from certain Taiwanese Famiclones and shrinked into a single ASIC chip (or epoxy blob in your case). They have a number of differences from real Famicoms, and some clones do not work well with the Everdrive N8 or the Pro at all, not only save states. Clone compatibility should be higher with the Everdrives than with some other flashcarts such as the Powerpak though.
I'm not so sure that all NOACs has problems with save states but some clones certainly do.

You are right that there is no way to access the I/O line directly from the cartridge side. The cart slot is mainly for adding ROM to an otherwise ROMless system. Krikzz said that the Pro watches the address and data lines in the background to implement save states.

Offline samenute

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2021, 09:23 PM »
So I bought a broken NES on eBay and replaced the cartridge connector and it works now.  With that I was able to verify that the save states not working are only a problem with the FC Dual.

I noticed another problem with it as well.  When playing games, though it's kind of random, every few minutes it will stop accepting controller input for a few seconds.  The game continues to run, it just doesn't respond to controller input for those few seconds, and the length of time that it doesn't respond seems identical every time it happens.  I've only been playing with the real NES for a few hours but so far I haven't seen that problem with it, so apparently that's just another problem with the FC Dual.

FWIW, I also bought a Super Everdrive and I haven't had any problems at all using it with the FC Dual.

Online nuu

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Re: What exactly do I have to do for save states to work?
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2021, 10:02 AM »
Sounds like the FC Dual is pretty shitty as a Famiclone.