EverDrive Forum

General => Mega EverDrive => Topic started by: Necronomfive on August 06, 2017, 10:11 PM

Title: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 06, 2017, 10:11 PM
Hello everybody,

some people here probably know me as the guy who did the Konami VRC7 FM sound core for the Everdrive N8.

Developing the whole FM core from scratch, just for one single Nintendo Famicom game, certainly seemed to be a bit eccentric, even though, of course being a Konami game, it has a great soundtrack.

My suggestion to krikzz was that I can expand the VRC7 into a full Yamaha YM2413 core.

Because, if there is one console on the planet, which deserves a much better sound chip, it's the highly underrated 8-bit predecessor of the Sega Mega Drive, the Master System. ;)

So, ladies and gentlemen,here is a first test core for the Mega Everdrive, which adds FULL FM SOUND for Master System Games supporting the FM sound expansion. And these are not too few...

Get it here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=40646713805814414368

It still has some smaller inaccuracies, but I think that it might already serve most of the people here well enough.

This update is for the Mega Everdrive v2 / X7. Just replace the /MEGA/MEGA.RBF file with MEGA.RBF from the archive.

Feedback and suggestions are always most welcome.

Enjoy!

Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: leonquest on August 07, 2017, 08:19 AM
Once again, thank you, you've exceeded all expectations.  Question, does it also work with the ME x3? You only mentioned it works with x7...
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Greg2600 on August 07, 2017, 04:25 PM
Wow, very cool addition!  Unfortunately, I think my Mega Everdrive is in fact an X5, in this new and confusing scheme, so it won't work.  I bought it as a V2 in 2015.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Sarge on August 07, 2017, 06:32 PM
Nice!  Hopefully I'll be able to give this a shot this evening!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 07, 2017, 06:38 PM
Oh, wow! This deserves official integration. Ideally, it could be included with a menu option to turn it on/off. Would that be potentially possible through an OS update? That would make it easier to switch between a Genesis and Nomad (which doesn't have FM support without modding).

Incredible work, Necronomfive! 8)

Unfortunately, I think my Mega Everdrive is in fact an X5, in this new and confusing scheme, so it won't work.  I bought it as a V2 in 2015.
Nope, you've got an X7 :D
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: pcfreak324 on August 07, 2017, 06:49 PM
Great! This is one if not the most needed feature.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: FeverDrive on August 07, 2017, 09:55 PM
Excellent news, could this work with MegaED X5 - MegaED X3 ?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 07, 2017, 11:02 PM
Hello all,

thanks for the positive responses so far!  :)

Let's address some questions:

Question, does it also work with the ME x3? You only mentioned it works with x7...

It should work with all Mega Everdrives which are based on the Mega Everdrive V2 Design.

Meaning:

- Altera Cyclone II EP2C5 FPGA
- Using PSRAM for memory storage

Oh, wow! This deserves official integration.


I gave krikzz permission to use this core for official Everdrive X7 / V2 updates. So from now on, it will be a permanent addition to the Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 feature set.

Quote
Ideally, it could be included with a menu option to turn it on/off. Would that be potentially possible through an OS update? That would make it easier to switch between a Genesis and Nomad (which doesn't have FM support without modding).

Not only can the YM2413 be switched on/off, but the new FPGA core also implements SMS Bios support.
So the Mega Drive can finally boot-up like a real Master System, which might also help with certain compatibility issues.

To enable both features, krikzz needs to implement the necessary functionality in the OS.

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 01:01 AM
That's music to my ears. You just made my year.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 01:20 AM
EDIT: I just noticed the X3/X5 use a different FPGA :(
http://www.latticesemi.com/iCE40 (http://www.latticesemi.com/iCE40)

This is great news!! but I'm bummed I upgraded to MEGA X5. I never thought we'd get SMS FM since it's been requested so many years. I wish it was possible to patch MEGA X3/X5, even if it meant soldering JTAG adapter.

I compared the stock RBF files X5/X7 and they're identical. So wouldn't it just require getting the firmware onto X5 core manually with same file on SD?

Those RBF files used only by v2/X7. X3 and X5 does not have enough FPGA resources for FM core and they even don't have audio outputs, so, this update possible only for v2/x7 users.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: keropi on August 08, 2017, 01:24 AM
what about the original Mega-ED? is it supported?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Marteicos on August 08, 2017, 03:37 AM
Is it possible to implement the sms bios support into x3 and x5 Mega Everdrives?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Assman on August 08, 2017, 04:35 AM
It's incredibly awesome that someone has finally done this after all these years of fading hope and speculation. Is there any chance of getting this running on the Mega ED V1's FPGA?

Much kudos to you, sir.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Greg2600 on August 08, 2017, 05:49 AM
Yup, works great on my X7/V2! 
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: goldenband on August 08, 2017, 06:12 AM
Terrific news! I don't have the right hardware to support this right now since my EverDrive is an original EverDrive-MD, but it's a good reason to upgrade in the future. I have a Master System and an FM upgrade board, but have never gotten around to installing it...
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 11:31 AM
what about the original Mega-ED? is it supported?
Mega-ed v1 support stopped few years ago and i have no any plans to work over updates for v1. Also this update will not fit in mega-v1, according to my calculations, because v1 used more fpga resources than v2. At the moment fpga used on 96% on mega-v2
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: keropi on August 08, 2017, 12:37 PM
well that's sad news for obvious reasons since the original mega-ed was a premium cart ... but if it does not fit then nothing to do really
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 02:53 PM
I just finished Necronomfive's FM core integration. Here is test OS build: http://krikzz.com/pub/rc/MEGAOS-V3.04-RC1.zip
Aside of FM supports, it supports sms bios loading. Details about bios function in sms-bios-readme.txt
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 06:00 PM
Wow, that was fast! 8)

I'm reading about the different SMS bios (http://www.smspower.org/Development/BIOSes). It seems like the Uncommon BIOS v2.0 (http://www.smspower.org/Development/BIOSes#UncommonBIOSV201987) might be the best choice? If not, what exact bios would be the best choice for compatibility? Or are the checks overridden by the MED anyways?

Also, in Krikzz's video, I see a CDBIOS.BIN in the Mega folder as well. Is that where we put a CD bios to use the "run cd" option?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Marteicos on August 08, 2017, 06:09 PM
I just finished Necronomfive's FM core integration. Here is test OS build: http://krikzz.com/pub/rc/MEGAOS-V3.04-RC1.zip
Aside of FM supports, it supports sms bios loading. Details about bios function in sms-bios-readme.txt

There is zero way make sms bios loading working with x3 and x5 Everdrives?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Greg2600 on August 08, 2017, 06:24 PM
There is zero way make sms bios loading working with x3 and x5 Everdrives?

Those cheaper models have less expensive components, which also means the components (FPGA) are not as powerful.  He doesn't feel it can be done.

Terrific news! I don't have the right hardware to support this right now since my EverDrive is an original EverDrive-MD, but it's a good reason to upgrade in the future. I have a Master System and an FM upgrade board, but have never gotten around to installing it...

I have an FM upgraded SMS as well!  Ha ha ha, had someone else install it.  I will say that SMS Bios is probably not going to fix incompatible SMS games on the Genesis.  Those do not work because SEGA removed the VDP modes they require, same as SG-1000, from the Genesis/MegaDrive.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 07:27 PM
Also, in Krikzz's video, I see a CDBIOS.BIN in the Mega folder as well. Is that where we put a CD bios to use the "run cd" option?
This is dump of bios from my cd unit, cart makes it when boot cd from internal bios

Is it possible to implement the sms bios support into x3 and x5 Mega Everdrives?

No, x3 and X5 not supports FPGA core update.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 07:40 PM
The OS option to enable/disable YM2413 also controls whether an SMS bios is loaded it seems. Will it be possible to use a real SMS bios, but without FM sound?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: TeaJay on August 08, 2017, 08:09 PM
It seems that after adding this the in-game menu no longer works on my X7. The option is OFF and it's greyed out in the options menu.

e: after using the files Krikzz posted earlier, it works again. The game music volume is lower on the SMS games that use the FM sound than when I was using the original file in the OP.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 08:12 PM
In game menu still works fine for me. Do you have a 32X attached?

Also, are you sure that you have an X7 (or V2)? It's the only Mega EverDrive with IGM support.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 08:23 PM
The OS option to enable/disable YM2413 also controls whether an SMS bios is loaded it seems. Will it be possible to use a real SMS bios, but without FM sound?
Bios and fm sound functions works independently

Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: TeaJay on August 08, 2017, 08:25 PM
In game menu still works fine for me. Do you have a 32X attached?

Also, are you sure that you have an X7 (or V2)? It's the only Mega EverDrive with IGM support.

Yes, I have the V2, and I was using the FM sound file successfully when testing it yesterday. I just noticed today that the in-game menu also stopped working. No 32x here either.

Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 08:26 PM
It seems that after adding this the in-game menu no longer works on my X7. The option is OFF and it's greyed out in the options menu.

e: after using the files Krikzz posted earlier, it works again. The game music volume is lower on the SMS games that use the FM sound than when I was using the original file in the OP.

You used OS 3.04 RC1 or Necronomfive's RBF file?

Yes, I have the V2, and I was using the FM sound file successfully when testing it yesterday. I just noticed today that the in-game menu also stopped working. No 32x here either.
[/quote]
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: TeaJay on August 08, 2017, 08:28 PM
You used OS 3.04 RC1 or Necronomfive's RBF file?

I used Necronomfive's RBF file and in-game menu did not work with it. After I used the file you posted (with the integrated OS) it started working again. (but like I said the volume is lower than it was when I used the RBF file.)
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 08:38 PM
Necronomfive's RBF not supports save states, it will work only on official OS update
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 09:07 PM
Bios and fm sound functions works independently
On my Nomad (SMS modded, with X7 OS V3.04-RC1) if I turn off YM2413, SMS bios loading doesn't work.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 09:29 PM
Bios and fm sound functions works independently
On my Nomad (SMS modded, with X7 OS V3.04-RC1) if I turn off YM2413, SMS bios loading doesn't work.
Oh, right,  now i see where the problem
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 09:45 PM
Try fixed RC2 http://krikzz.com/pub/rc/MEGAOS-V3.04-RC2.zip
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 09:52 PM
That worked to get the US bios (v1.3) loading when YM2413 is disabled, thanks!
Update: I've also tested Uncommon Bios v2.0 (http://www.smspower.org/forums/15172-SMSBIOSVersion20V20) successfully.

I can't seem to get the Japan Bios v2.1 to work though. If I try to use it, it just skips the bios and loads a game as if the bios option is disabled. Edit: It works. The Japanese bios just doesn't have a splash screen.

Also, the M404 Prototype Bios boots correctly but never progresses to loading a game. Edit: Nevermind, M404 does work correctly. I didn't realize that it only supports two games (Japanese Fantasy Zone & Choplifter).
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on August 08, 2017, 10:02 PM
I guess that japanese bios does not have splash screen
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: brianvgplayer on August 08, 2017, 10:22 PM
I guess that japanese bios does not have splash screen

I have a JP SMS. There is no splash screen like with the US SMS, just a screen playing Space Harrier music in FM when no game in the system.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 08, 2017, 10:30 PM
Excellent. In that case, everything seems to work perfectly.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: wolfpacleader1986 on August 09, 2017, 02:48 AM
Great work on this! Tried the RC2 and it seems the volume is still low. I have to put my TV up to 72 to be able to hear the stereo sound on my model 1 Genesis using RGB SCART.

It seems a little better with headphones, but still a little low.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: brianvgplayer on August 09, 2017, 08:24 AM
The music sounds lower to me than the earlier RBF file and my JP SMS.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 09, 2017, 09:28 PM
This made the RetroRGB Weekly News (coverage starts at 31:03): https://youtu.be/qGJqnUlAoVU?t=31m3s
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: dvd2vcd on August 10, 2017, 01:01 AM
Would be awesome to implement this fm into a new master everdrive V2 😉
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: phoenixdownita on August 10, 2017, 07:47 AM
Would be awesome to implement this fm into a new master everdrive V2 😉
SMS does not have audio pins on the cart so it is not gonna happen.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 10, 2017, 11:15 PM
The music sounds lower to me than the earlier RBF file and my JP SMS.

I have rechecked this, and can not confirm it. On my PAL Mega Drive V1 (no TMSS), both mine and krikzz's FPGA cores have identical volume.

Btw, the music volume depends strongly on the game. Some games are much quieter than other games.

Regarding the overall volume: yeah, my FPGA YM2413 is a bit quieter than the on-board YM2612.

On the other hand, I can only increase the volume in the digital domain. All YM2413 channels require a total dynamic range of 13 bits.

I have already compromised, and reduced it to 12 bits, which will already introduce slight clipping if all melodic and rhythm channels fire at once.

But, if I bit-crush the signal once more down to 11 bits, I start to get nasty clipping artefacts (phasing) when all melodic channels are being used (e.g. start-up sound of Chris Covell's YM2413 Tool).

So, just to get ahead of a possible debate here: no, I refuse to further increase the volume of the core, and butchering the audio quality just because people do not want to grab their TV remotes. ;)

BR,

Necronomfive

Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: wolfpacleader1986 on August 11, 2017, 12:56 AM
So, just to get ahead of a possible debate here: no, I refuse to further increase the volume of the core, and butchering the audio quality just because people do not want to grab their TV remotes. ;)

It seems fine when listening on a model 1 with headphones. It's just that when you listen through the TV, it's very low. Unless the FM uses stereo sound and it higher on the audio channel that's not plugged in to the TV. I do have a model 2 Genesis, I have to hook it up and see if I'm right as you can use stereo sound with the AV on that system.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 11, 2017, 01:41 AM
It seems fine when listening on a model 1 with headphones. It's just that when you listen through the TV, it's very low. Unless the FM uses stereo sound and it higher on the audio channel that's not plugged in to the TV. I do have a model 2 Genesis, I have to hook it up and see if I'm right as you can use stereo sound with the AV on that system.

My FM core drives both left and right audio pins with the same 50MHz 1 bit dithered signal. There is no difference in volume (you can easily check using headphones).

The signal is mixed from stereo to mono for the AV out of the Model 1, so I'm not sure to which channel you are referring, which is not supposed to be plugged to the TV.

Furthermore, on my TV, the mixing ratio between YM2612 and my FPGA YM2413 resembles the mixing ratio I hear on the headphone jacket of my Model 1.

On both, the YM2413 is only slightly quieter than the internal YM2612.

Using both mine and krikzz bitstreams, which are using exactly the same FM core, using exactly the same method to drive the DAC output pins on the FPGA.

So, again, I'm sorry but I can not confirm your observations.

Let's see what your test on the Model 2 will reveal.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: brianvgplayer on August 11, 2017, 04:39 AM
I have a JP SMS and I don't have to turn the volume up to hear the music on it. The music is definitely much quieter on the Mega Everdive than a real SMS and it's disappointing that it won't be adjusted. I also noticed a difference when using the earlier RBF file with the earlier OS, but noticed no difference when using it with the newer OS. I don't understand this "I didn't see it on my end so you're full of crap" attititude. I check things multiple times and I don't make things up.

Never mind. I had the wrong white plug in the TV (sega cd instead of Genesis AV cable). Audio definitely sounded closer to the JP SMS after using the direct audio from the Genesis and I only had to turn the TV up slightly. Sorry about that. doh.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 11, 2017, 03:07 PM
I don't understand this "I didn't see it on my end so you're full of crap" attititude.

Whoa, buddy! This is way out of line!  :(

Ever occured to you that I actually wasted MY time on you to actually reproduce your problem?

And when I failed to reproduce it, even though I already had a very strong feeling about the eventual outcome, I still tried to explore the background of your observation.

So this is what I get? Being put nasty words in my mouth!?! :(

Quote
Never mind.

Nope, I DO mind such rude behavior! :(

I don't know if you realize this, but just because you are using my core, doesn't give you the entitlement to treat me as service personnel.

In fact, I don't have to answer you at all.

And if I answer, the least I expect from people is to spend a minimum amount of effort on their side. Like, being able to hook up their console correctly, before enganging in pseudo-technical reasoning with the developers.

Quote
Sorry about that. doh.

You're welcome! :(
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 11, 2017, 03:28 PM
Edit: It works. The Japanese bios just doesn't have a splash screen.

Just keep the japanese bios enabled, and try loading this here:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=78491692528405036591

It's using both YM2413 & PSG for music.

This also works with the US/EU bios. There is a hidden game available... ;)

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 11, 2017, 07:22 PM
Perfect, thank you! :D

(https://s28.postimg.org/psz4gk4fv/DSC1746_2.jpg) (https://s27.postimg.org/hfqg48g29/DSC1746.jpg)
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: leonquest on August 11, 2017, 08:22 PM
I have a JP SMS and I don't have to turn the volume up to hear the music on it. The music is definitely much quieter on the Mega Everdive than a real SMS and it's disappointing that it won't be adjusted. I also noticed a difference when using the earlier RBF file with the earlier OS, but noticed no difference when using it with the newer OS. I don't understand this "I didn't see it on my end so you're full of crap" attititude. I check things multiple times and I don't make things up.

Never mind. I had the wrong white plug in the TV (sega cd instead of Genesis AV cable). Audio definitely sounded closer to the JP SMS after using the direct audio from the Genesis and I only had to turn the TV up slightly. Sorry about that. doh.

wow, what an asshole. He gives you FM sound for free and you give him crap for it.

I seriously hope this gets you banned at least for a month.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: brianvgplayer on August 11, 2017, 09:32 PM
I have a JP SMS and I don't have to turn the volume up to hear the music on it. The music is definitely much quieter on the Mega Everdive than a real SMS and it's disappointing that it won't be adjusted. I also noticed a difference when using the earlier RBF file with the earlier OS, but noticed no difference when using it with the newer OS. I don't understand this "I didn't see it on my end so you're full of crap" attititude. I check things multiple times and I don't make things up.

Never mind. I had the wrong white plug in the TV (sega cd instead of Genesis AV cable). Audio definitely sounded closer to the JP SMS after using the direct audio from the Genesis and I only had to turn the TV up slightly. Sorry about that. doh.

wow, what an asshole. He gives you FM sound for free and you give him crap for it.

I seriously hope this gets you banned at least for a month.

I'm sorry I took it the wrong way, but I realized I messed up and kept what I said up before I edited the post to add the never mind because I didn't want to delete and hide the fact that I messed up. I don't purposely try to be rude, but I honestly do check things multiple times before posting and have had situations where people assumed nothing was wrong when there was something wrong. BTW, the intent of the post was to say that I don't like being treated poorly, not to treat you like service personnel or imply that you didn't do anything on your end. Anyway, I am sorry for what I said and thank you for adding FM to the Mega Everdrive.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: wolfpacleader1986 on August 12, 2017, 12:11 AM
It seems fine when listening on a model 1 with headphones. It's just that when you listen through the TV, it's very low. Unless the FM uses stereo sound and it higher on the audio channel that's not plugged in to the TV. I do have a model 2 Genesis, I have to hook it up and see if I'm right as you can use stereo sound with the AV on that system.

My FM core drives both left and right audio pins with the same 50MHz 1 bit dithered signal. There is no difference in volume (you can easily check using headphones).

The signal is mixed from stereo to mono for the AV out of the Model 1, so I'm not sure to which channel you are referring, which is not supposed to be plugged to the TV.

Furthermore, on my TV, the mixing ratio between YM2612 and my FPGA YM2413 resembles the mixing ratio I hear on the headphone jacket of my Model 1.

On both, the YM2413 is only slightly quieter than the internal YM2612.

Using both mine and krikzz bitstreams, which are using exactly the same FM core, using exactly the same method to drive the DAC output pins on the FPGA.

So, again, I'm sorry but I can not confirm your observations.

Let's see what your test on the Model 2 will reveal.

I just either have to find my AV cord for it or my SCART. I don't have a SCART with headphone adapter for the model 1, which is why I mentioned the model 2.

Perfect, thank you! :D

and thank YOU. Seriously, your ready made packs are a real lifesaver!!!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 15, 2017, 08:57 AM
Hello all,

I have prepared a new test FPGA core for you:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=41594430196977865685

It fixes a serious bug in the rhythm note trigger function (which, obviously, has been missed by most people  :P ;) ).

The ryhthm tracks of most games should now sound correctly. Most notorious example is Out Run.

Please note that this is a test core wil limited feature set. Only krikzz can do fully feratured cores.

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 17, 2017, 03:01 AM
Thank you very much for this new feature  :)

And very sad that krikkz in YEARS never figured to add it to the expensive mega everdrive.

 
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 17, 2017, 03:22 AM
And very sad that krikkz in YEARS never figured to add it to the expensive mega everdrive.
What a crass thing to say. Krikzz built the functionality in so geniuses like Necronomfive can make projects like this happen. Then Krikzz integrated the new features into the OS within days. You won't find that kind of support anywhere else.

Both Necronomfive and Krikzz are providing amazing free updates. Be thankful! ;D
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 17, 2017, 04:02 AM
at least krikkz ported it to a new OS, happy to load finally the jap bios

chip emulation vs real one is identical or not? there's a video?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: FeverDrive on August 17, 2017, 10:19 PM
Thank you very much for this new feature  :)

And very sad that krikkz in YEARS never figured to add it to the expensive mega everdrive.
I guess it didn't make sense for Krikzz to look into it (limited time).
He has to spend his time in higher value activities, thankfully once the work was done he could easily add this feature to the FPGA.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: chrisw80 on August 18, 2017, 02:45 PM
Thank You!!! Lost all hope for this. Now if only we can get the Game Gear Everdrive and Master Everdrive issues sorted out. SG-1000 Games not working and Game Gear games not saving.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 18, 2017, 11:05 PM
Thank you very much for this new feature  :)

And very sad that krikkz in YEARS never figured to add it to the expensive mega everdrive.
I guess it didn't make sense for Krikzz to look into it (limited time).
He has to spend his time in higher value activities, thankfully once the work was done he could easily add this feature to the FPGA.
users asked for this things from many years...(no excuses here) and for new nes mappers...only thanks to this guy is now possible. And now he can sell he's card with new improved features also. I expeting this updates from krikzz himself, also today fds sound is still horrible for example

would be perfect if MS games have the ingame menu with saving support like mega drive games
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: chrisw80 on August 19, 2017, 01:43 AM
Perfect, thank you! :D

(https://s28.postimg.org/psz4gk4fv/DSC1746_2.jpg) (https://s27.postimg.org/hfqg48g29/DSC1746.jpg)

You motivated me to do the SMS enable on both my Nomads. Already did the screen replacement and recapped it. Now just have to reconnect the audio lines to the cartridge slot so I can hear the FM sound on it. The Nomad really is the best Genesis and SMS.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 19, 2017, 03:10 AM
you have a guide to reconnect sound lines to hear fm? on my nomad fm sound on MS games not works.

also on sonic 3 i can hear only 1 ring sound, the second ring collected is muted, why? is that normal or what?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: chrisw80 on August 19, 2017, 06:22 AM
I was going to try this. https://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=3674.0

You already responded to it. Wish he would of included some pictures.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on August 19, 2017, 08:32 AM
You motivated me to do the SMS enable on both my Nomads. Already did the screen replacement and recapped it. Now just have to reconnect the audio lines to the cartridge slot so I can hear the FM sound on it. The Nomad really is the best Genesis and SMS.
Sweet! I need to connect the audio pins on mine too. I'm 5,000 miles from my soldering equipment until December though. So Necronomfive and Krikzz literally game me a Christmas present to look forward to with this new development ;D

I put a new speaker in my Nomad when I recapped and LCD-modded it, which gives it a little more volume. I posted a video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KbGGBFd5fI) of the new Sonic Mania FMV playing on my modded Nomad if you're curious to see/hear it.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: chrisw80 on August 19, 2017, 11:27 AM
You motivated me to do the SMS enable on both my Nomads. Already did the screen replacement and recapped it. Now just have to reconnect the audio lines to the cartridge slot so I can hear the FM sound on it. The Nomad really is the best Genesis and SMS.
Sweet! I need to connect the audio pins on mine too. I'm 5,000 miles from my soldering equipment until December though. So Necronomfive and Krikzz literally game me a Christmas present to look forward to with this new development ;D

I put a new speaker in my Nomad when I recapped and LCD-modded it, which gives it a little more volume. I posted a video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KbGGBFd5fI) of the new Sonic Mania FMV playing on my modded Nomad if you're curious to see/hear it.

You will have to let me know what speaker you put in there. I swapped mine with a game gear one and it made a difference. Not huge but better than stock. It's weird when I run that on my nomad with Mega Everdrive v2 I get no sound. Lol, it works just have to actually download the version with sound...
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on August 23, 2017, 12:11 PM
Because, if there is one console on the planet, which deserves a much better sound chip, it's the highly underrated 8-bit predecessor of the Sega Mega Drive, the Master System. ;)

So, ladies and gentlemen,here is a first test core for the Mega Everdrive, which adds FULL FM SOUND for Master System Games supporting the FM sound expansion. And these are not too few...

Tried this out last night with both Shinobi and the SMS Power translation of Phantasy Star. Wow - this sounds absolutely fantastic! Does this have less background noise/buzz than discrete YM2413 solutions, similar to the ASIC YM3438 vs the discrete YM2612 in Mega Drive models? It wasn't really noticeable at all in my quick test, but I've heard things like the PowerBase FM or VileTim's SMS FM addon can be quite noisy.

Anyway, thank you hugely, and let me know if you have any kind of tip jar - you've added huge value to my Mega Everdrive and saved me having to import any additional hardware to get the FM-SMS experience, so I feel I owe you a quid or two!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Mister Xiado on August 23, 2017, 06:46 PM
Bleh, I still have a V1, so I have very little incentive to get another with 95%+ duplicate functionality. I'm still on the fence about getting something for SNES or N64.

also on sonic 3 i can hear only 1 ring sound, the second ring collected is muted, why? is that normal or what?
Ring pickup sounds alternate between left and right. If you only hear every other ring, you're not getting stereo sound. Most Genesis 2 AV cables out there were wired wrong, and aren't actually stereo.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 23, 2017, 07:51 PM
Thank you very much for this new feature  :)

And very sad that krikkz in YEARS never figured to add it to the expensive mega everdrive.
I guess it didn't make sense for Krikzz to look into it (limited time).
He has to spend his time in higher value activities, thankfully once the work was done he could easily add this feature to the FPGA.
users asked for this things from many years...(no excuses here) and for new nes mappers...only thanks to this guy is now possible. And now he can sell he's card with new improved features also. I expeting this updates from krikzz himself. Also today fds sound is still horrible for example on edn8.

would be perfect if MS games have the ingame menu with saving support like mega drive games
just only to say i was right...krikzz already updated infos with new FM core in his shop on megaED x7...

we waited years and years for new features from him, instead we lost the auto alphabetical order from mdv1.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 24, 2017, 01:30 AM
Tried this out last night with both Shinobi and the SMS Power translation of Phantasy Star. Wow - this sounds absolutely fantastic! Does this have less background noise/buzz than discrete YM2413 solutions, similar to the ASIC YM3438 vs the discrete YM2612 in Mega Drive models? It wasn't really noticeable at all in my quick test, but I've heard things like the PowerBase FM or VileTim's SMS FM addon can be quite noisy.

I think this will depend heavily on the mixing circuit and age of your console. My Model 1 has a slight static buzzing noise over the headphone output (probably should recap it some day). Also, the Model 1 mixer tends to cut-off some of the higher frequency range. As a counter example, on the Everdrive N8 VRC7 mapper on my AV Famicom, the sound is much cleaner and sharper, despite using the same core.

In theory, the sound of the FPGA core should be more "clean" than the sound of the original chip. Whether that is desired is of course another question. :)

Quote
Anyway, thank you hugely, and let me know if you have any kind of tip jar - you've added huge value to my Mega Everdrive and saved me having to import any additional hardware to get the FM-SMS experience, so I feel I owe you a quid or two!

Thank you. :)

Your post here is already more than enough contribution.

Retro gaming and development is my hobby, meaning that my primary motivation is based on creating things which, firstly, get me excited.

The SMS FM sound was never an officially advertised feature of the Mega Everdrive, which I bought it on exactly those terms, and I have always been happy with it.

And yet, after making the VRC7 mapper, I saw the opportunity to add it as a nice bonus. So I did it. Now I have SMS FM sound, cool!  8)

What puzzles me to no end is how some people still manage to pull such negativity from other people's free contributions... Aren't there better ways spending your free time?

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: stlpaul on August 27, 2017, 10:07 AM
Wow! Awesome job. I just tried it and it sounds great! I have a Japanese Master System and it sounds just like the real thing to me.

I didn't experience any background noise at all on my 1989 model 1 Genesis. I'm using RGB (into Framemeister) with audio patched in from the headphone jack.

Thanks for your hard work and sharing it with us!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: mattw77777 on August 28, 2017, 11:48 PM
i am late to the party, but I want to say thank you to Necronomfive and krikzz for making this happen.

i am having problems getting it to work. when i switch ym2413 on in the menu, i get no sound at all on the games that support it. regular SMS games sound fine. i am using a japan MD model 2 VA0 with the current firmware v3.04

thank you!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: RetroRGB on August 29, 2017, 05:55 PM
@Necronomfive - Excellent work, the sound is really accurate to the original:  https://youtu.be/ayKxnrYCpPI
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on August 31, 2017, 05:40 AM
Tried this out last night with both Shinobi and the SMS Power translation of Phantasy Star. Wow - this sounds absolutely fantastic! Does this have less background noise/buzz than discrete YM2413 solutions, similar to the ASIC YM3438 vs the discrete YM2612 in Mega Drive models? It wasn't really noticeable at all in my quick test, but I've heard things like the PowerBase FM or VileTim's SMS FM addon can be quite noisy.

I think this will depend heavily on the mixing circuit and age of your console. My Model 1 has a slight static buzzing noise over the headphone output (probably should recap it some day). Also, the Model 1 mixer tends to cut-off some of the higher frequency range. As a counter example, on the Everdrive N8 VRC7 mapper on my AV Famicom, the sound is much cleaner and sharper, despite using the same core.

In theory, the sound of the FPGA core should be more "clean" than the sound of the original chip. Whether that is desired is of course another question. :)

Quote
Anyway, thank you hugely, and let me know if you have any kind of tip jar - you've added huge value to my Mega Everdrive and saved me having to import any additional hardware to get the FM-SMS experience, so I feel I owe you a quid or two!

Thank you. :)

Your post here is already more than enough contribution.

Retro gaming and development is my hobby, meaning that my primary motivation is based on creating things which, firstly, get me excited.

The SMS FM sound was never an officially advertised feature of the Mega Everdrive, which I bought it on exactly those terms, and I have always been happy with it.

And yet, after making the VRC7 mapper, I saw the opportunity to add it as a nice bonus. So I did it. Now I have SMS FM sound, cool!  8)

What puzzles me to no end is how some people still manage to pull such negativity from other people's free contributions... Aren't there better ways spending your free time?

BR,

Necronomfive
if you was referring to me..i was talking to krikzz, not to you of course, i have already thanked you in previous post  :)
but i'm hungry with krikzz for he's poor support to hardware, example the bad fds sound and no new mappers or other example is the GG card, there are still games that don't boot or have problems...after 7 years or so? And really he have put out a gbed x5 card with instant loading after only 2 years the normal GBED was out? no words, very disappointed.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on August 31, 2017, 10:10 PM
i am having problems getting it to work. when i switch ym2413 on in the menu, i get no sound at all on the games that support it. regular SMS games sound fine. i am using a japan MD model 2 VA0 with the current firmware v3.04

thank you!

Checklist of some relevant items:

- Is your MD modded in any kind of way (e.g. audio amplification circuit mod)?
- How is your MD hooked to your TV?
- Anything else hooked to your MD? (e.g. Mega CD, 32X)
- What happens if you try to play WAV files?
- Is an SMS game >= 128K working correctly?
- Is the bios working correctly? (e.g. does it boot from splash screen to the game correctly?)

@Necronomfive - Excellent work, the sound is really accurate to the original:  https://youtu.be/ayKxnrYCpPI

Thank you for the comparison! It's good to know that a real YM2413 sent through the MD has the same kind of low-pass filtering from the audio mixing circuit. This has actual relevance for me, because now I know that the update rate for the noise LFSR is actually correct in my core.

Quote
but i'm hungry with krikzz for he's poor support to hardware, example the bad fds sound and no new mappers or other example is the GG card, there are still games that don't boot or have problems...after 7 years or so? And really he have put out a gbed x5 card with instant loading after only 2 years the normal GBED was out? no words, very disappointed.

Since YM2413 was never advertised for the Mega ED, I fail to see the relevance of your various grievances to my contribution here.

Therefore, I kindly ask you to start your own individual threads to vent your disappointment about various of krikzz products.

The next thing would be someone complaining here about the lack of 3D glasses support for the SMS mode.... Now THAT is actually a feature which has been available in the US / EUROPE!

Ups! Sorry, krikzz! ;)

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on September 02, 2017, 10:14 PM
it was ONLY an example, no one want to go offtopic here. you talked about me and i have replied to you, simple :)
Quote
Since YM2413 was never advertised for the Mega ED
wrong: now is advertised officially.
Quote
your various grievances to my contribution here.
wrong again. i don't want to do any of that to you. i thanked you for your work. Instead of krikzz that not improve nothing here. Not even a simple auto sort.

For fm sound: i hate how low pass filtering sound and love the sound of original jap sms, there's no way to eliminate the filter?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: mattw77777 on September 02, 2017, 11:32 PM
i am having problems getting it to work. when i switch ym2413 on in the menu, i get no sound at all on the games that support it. regular SMS games sound fine. i am using a japan MD model 2 VA0 with the current firmware v3.04

thank you!

Checklist of some relevant items:

- Is your MD modded in any kind of way (e.g. audio amplification circuit mod)?
    Yes, Mega Amp, installed correctly to YM3438 R&L and SN76489
- How is your MD hooked to your TV?
    composite A/V cables
- Anything else hooked to your MD? (e.g. Mega CD, 32X)
    No
- What happens if you try to play WAV files?
    When I highlight a WAV file and press A, nothing happens. It doesnt even load the file
- Is an SMS game >= 128K working correctly?
    No, I tried Fantasy Zone II and Golvellius. Game loads with no sound unless i disable the YM2413 in the menu
- Is the bios working correctly? (e.g. does it boot from splash screen to the game correctly?)
    Yes


In the spirit of true troubleshooting I tried my model 1 and model 3 genesis
On the VA2 model 1: WAV files opened but only weird garbled garbage came out, no music. SMS bios did not load games afterwards.
SMS FM function worked though!
Model 3 with mega amp and SMS mod: WAV files did nothing, SMS bios did not load games, and SMS FM also did not work
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on September 03, 2017, 01:50 AM
Checklist of some relevant items:
    Yes, Mega Amp, installed correctly to YM3438 R&L and SN76489

Yeah, but there is a third sound source which needs to be mixed: external signal coming from the cartridge port.

Regarding your Model 2:

Both YM2413 & WAV playback does not work.
SMS Bios function, however, does work.

-> Z80 I/O write cycle to FPGA does work (required by BIOS & YM2413)
-> MegaAmp probably does not mix the external audio signal

I would re-check the modification carefully.

Regarding your Model 3:

Model 3 Genesis does not support SMS mode AFAIK.

Quote
Since YM2413 was never advertised for the Mega ED
wrong: now is advertised officially.

Do you realise that your answer is, in no way, a contradiction to my original sentence?
Yes, it is now advertised officially. With my full endorsement, I might add.

So people, who buy an Everdrive X7 now, get the YM2413 as a free bonus on-top.
Before that, nobody had any real reason to complain about lack of YM2413 support. It was never advertised.

Understood now?

Quote
Quote
your various grievances to my contribution here.
wrong again. i don't want to do any of that to you.

First, learn to quote correctly.

THIS is what I wrote:

Quote from: Necronomfive
I fail to see the relevance of your various grievances to my contribution here.


Meaning: what has a discussion about lack of file sorting, FDS sound or EverDrive GB related stuff lost here?

Right, nothing.

Quote
it was ONLY an example, no one want to go offtopic here. you talked about me and i have replied to you, simple :)

(...)

Instead of krikzz that not improve nothing here. Not even a simple auto sort.

Yeah, right. Using my work as an argument to slag-off other people. While, at the same time, contributing nothing productive by yourself.

For me, this is the worst kind of way how to associate and mis-use my work. :(

Hence, those will now be my last words on this.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on September 04, 2017, 01:07 PM
I think from a Mega Amp perspective, you'll need to wire up the pads labelled 32x, as that was the main thing which used the cartridge audio pins. Not sure if the Mega Amp Mini includes pads for 32x or Mega CD, though.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: mattw77777 on September 04, 2017, 10:13 PM
Ok. Thank you. I did a minimal install of the Mega Amps and bypassed the 32x. Ill wire up the cartridge slots and let you all know if that fixes it. (Im sure it will)

the BIOS did not work on the model 1 or model 3... SMS functionality is restored on the model 3 with just a quick 1 wire mod

i know this is off topic, but any idea what would cause the WAV playback on my model 1 to sound like garbage?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on September 05, 2017, 05:13 PM
i know this is off topic, but any idea what would cause the WAV playback on my model 1 to sound like garbage?
It must be related to audio mixing circuit, if your audio circuit is modified, or may be something with audio files. Wav playback should sound just perfect on model 1
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: mattw77777 on September 05, 2017, 11:08 PM
thanx for the help Necronomfive. wiring the cartridge slot to the mega amp worked like a charm,
i dont know if i ever would have thought of that myself. now the bios and ym2413 are working on my model 1 and 2

thanx for the input KRIKzz. i've tried both 44100 and 48000 sample rates and both sound horrible. I assume its the files that i converted to WAV. I used the VGMPlay program to convert the .VGZ files to .WAV and my PC plays them fine.
Is there a better program to convert the .VGZ files? FYI i downloaded a sample .WAV ringtone and it played it ok, it just sped up the file so it sounded a couple of octaves higher

Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on September 06, 2017, 06:25 AM
Quote
this is the worst kind of way how to associate and mis-use my work.
necronomfive sorry if you saw that way, really.

i'm only hope a better support from krikzz as there many problems to be fixed in many cards.


For fm sound: i hate how low pass filtering sound and love the sound of original jap sms, there's no way to eliminate the filter?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: fox1918 on September 06, 2017, 06:28 AM
the bios and ym2413 are working on mega-everdrive 1 ?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: skins4thewin on September 06, 2017, 11:02 AM
[For fm sound: i hate how low pass filtering sound and love the sound of original jap sms, there's no way to eliminate the filter?

I second this.  The filter is WAY too strong and really hurts the sound.  What you think sounds good may not sound good to most, and this seems to be a recurring complaint.  The FM sound really should be able to be heard as originally intended with no filter if the user so chooses.  Should be easy enough to reduce the filter effect a bit or implement a menu option to turn it off completely. 

Is this something you can implement in a future update Necronomfive?  I went ahead and upgraded from an X5 to an X7 solely for your FM implementation, so I hope this is a feature that gets added sometime soon :)
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Necronomfive on September 06, 2017, 01:08 PM
I second this.  The filter is WAY too strong and really hurts the sound.  What you think sounds good may not sound good to most, and this seems to be a recurring complaint.  The FM sound really should be able to be heard as originally intended with no filter if the user so chooses.  Should be easy enough to reduce the filter effect a bit or implement a menu option to turn it off completely.

Ummm, you seem to be missing the fact that the filtering is caused by the internal Mega Drive amplification circuit. It also occurs using a real YM2413 (as shown by RetroRGB's comparison video). And for sure, it also affects the internal PSG & FM sound generation.

So, hardware modifications like MegaAmp actually DO exist for a reason. ;)

Btw, just one more clarification:

Quote
I went ahead and upgraded from an X5 to an X7 solely for your FM implementation, so I hope this is a feature that gets added sometime soon :)

I feel honored by your buying decision. However, my free contribution was developed in my spare time as a hobby. And I strictly like keep my hobby as a hobby.

Meaning: the fact that you invested money, does not spark any kind of obligation from my side to take your suggestions, since there is no customer relationship between us. ;)

Having said that, of course if you find a bug, I'm trying to fix it based on my personal time / interest. Differences in audio mixes / amplifications circuits clearly do not fall into this cathegory (same discussion in VRC7 mapper forum).

BR,

Necronomfive
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: skins4thewin on September 06, 2017, 03:25 PM
I second this.  The filter is WAY too strong and really hurts the sound.  What you think sounds good may not sound good to most, and this seems to be a recurring complaint.  The FM sound really should be able to be heard as originally intended with no filter if the user so chooses.  Should be easy enough to reduce the filter effect a bit or implement a menu option to turn it off completely.

Ummm, you seem to be missing the fact that the filtering is caused by the internal Mega Drive amplification circuit. It also occurs using a real YM2413 (as shown by RetroRGB's comparison video). And for sure, it also affects the internal PSG & FM sound generation.

So, hardware modifications like MegaAmp actually DO exist for a reason. ;)

Btw, just one more clarification:

Quote
I went ahead and upgraded from an X5 to an X7 solely for your FM implementation, so I hope this is a feature that gets added sometime soon :)

I feel honored by your buying decision. However, my free contribution was developed in my spare time as a hobby. And I strictly like keep my hobby as a hobby.

Meaning: the fact that you invested money, does not spark any kind of obligation from my side to take your suggestions, since there is no customer relationship between us. ;)

Having said that, of course if you find a bug, I'm trying to fix it based on my personal time / interest. Differences in audio mixes / amplifications circuits clearly do not fall into this cathegory (same discussion in VRC7 mapper forum).

BR,

Necronomfive

Ahhh, I did not know that about the internal amp, I thought it was due to the FM implementation itself.  Thanks for clearing that up.  I understand that the X7 Everdrive has some sort of Stereo DAC built in, what purpose does it serve?  Does it have anything to do with the audio output of the Genesis?

As for the consumer obligation thing, I think you definitely took that the wrong way... I definitely didn't mean it like that.  I was simply stating that I hoped that it would be fixed soon, as being an end user I would naturally want it working as well as possible.  Obviously it's your time spent on it and your choice, was just voicing my opinions on it.  It's fantastic to have the option for the FM sound due to your hard work, but I imagine you would want some user feedback on it too and would be a bit more open to suggestion.  It's your patch though, you can do whatever you like with it.

Speaking of which, after trying it out last night I should also point out that the FM sound volume is very low compared to the regular PSG volume, which is also shown with RetroRGB's comparison vid on Youtube where he had to crank the volume up so that it would match the others.  Is this also caused by the internal sound amp on the Genesis or is this something that can be adjusted within the mod?  Would be nice if there were an option for a Db increase in the menu as a possible fix.  Again just a suggestion, totally up to you if you want to implement it or not, if it is something capable of being implemented in the first place. 

I think this is probably a more glaring issue than the actual filtering, as all end users will have to boost the volume way up on their TV or Stereo whenever playing an FM game, and then turn it back down when not.  I am sure this will lead to a whole bunch of incidences of changing inputs and getting sudden blaring audio when switching back to the TV Tuner or something like that.

Thanks a bunch for the patch, I will certainly enjoy the heck out of it :)
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: fox1918 on September 06, 2017, 03:28 PM
Necronomfive

will there be support for the Mega Everdrive V1 ?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: skins4thewin on September 06, 2017, 03:30 PM
I believe I can answer that.  The answer is no, the lower model everdrives do not have the required hardware to implement it.  Only the V2 and X7 are capable of using the FM sound.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: fox1918 on September 07, 2017, 04:01 AM
I opened a post earlier about support for the ME v1. Why is the ME v1 not being supported anymore? I understand the V2 / X3/X5/X7 support is important for sales but a lot of people bought the ED v1 and still want support / fixes. and a final release of the V10 firmware.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Amerika on September 08, 2017, 09:18 AM
Fantastic!  I just tested this with my MED x7 and it works flawlessly on all of the games I tried.  If there are issues, I certainly didn't notice them.

Great work man!

And yes, I second the idea of adding this into the official release and including a toggle to go between regular and FM sound (maybe hold a button on load?).
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: chrisw80 on September 09, 2017, 05:37 AM
I opened a post earlier about support for the ME v1. Why is the ME v1 not being supported anymore? I understand the V2 / X3/X5/X7 support is important for sales but a lot of people bought the ED v1 and still want support / fixes. and a final release of the V10 firmware.

Support has clearly ended for v1. Get a v2 or X7.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: lee4 on September 09, 2017, 10:58 PM
I guess people do NOT read krikzz comments on first page

Quote from: krikzz
Mega-ed v1 support stopped few years ago
and i have no any plans to work over updates for v1.

Also this update will not fit in mega-v1,

At the moment FPGA used on 96% on mega-v2

X3 and X5 not supports FPGA core update.
and they even don't have audio outputs,
so, this update possible only for v2/x7 users.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: skins4thewin on September 11, 2017, 06:27 PM
I would still really like to know about the volume imbalance issues and if that is hardware related or not and if it could be fixed in a future update?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on September 12, 2017, 01:22 PM
Hello all,

I have prepared a new test FPGA core for you:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=41594430196977865685

It fixes a serious bug in the rhythm note trigger function (which, obviously, has been missed by most people  :P ;) ).

The ryhthm tracks of most games should now sound correctly. Most notorious example is Out Run.

Please note that this is a test core wil limited feature set. Only krikzz can do fully feratured cores.

BR,

Necronomfive

Has testing on this one gone OK, and if so, any word on when this fix will be integrated into a fully featured core? I see 3.04 was officially released on the 12th, so presumably doesn't include this.

Keen to start an FM Phantasy Star playthrough on an official core, but don't want to do so while there are still known bugs in the FM driver.

Cheers again for all your work!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: brianvgplayer on September 14, 2017, 11:46 PM
I did notice the buzzing in Outrun (and a similar thing happened with games with the Namco sound chip on Everdrive N8) in 3.04, but was afraid to mention it due to my stupid outburst. I also feel it was rude to imply that I don't know how to hook my console correctly. I have the system hooked up via the SEGA CD stereo for the games that use it and usually switch to the native audio for non-CD games. People make mistakes!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: dvd2vcd on September 20, 2017, 08:42 PM
I did notice the buzzing in Outrun
Yes so did I.  As you start a race and as you enter the next level also. The noise disappears when you drive off road. Strange....
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: phoenixdownita on September 21, 2017, 08:01 AM
Not strange at all, even Tim SMS FM boards pre 2.2 have the same issue (and that's all HW):

http://etim.net.au/smsfm/smsfm.html

"In late 2014 there was some extra details discovered about the Japanese SMS sound hardware on detailed in this thread. The benefit is there are no longer 'extra' sound effects playing in Outrun at the start of a race."

http://www.smspower.org/forums/14998-SonicFMHackEnablingPSGFMMixing

Basically non Jap SMS need to be timed carefully wrt Outrun and its use of mixed FM/PSG, Tim made a fix on board v2.2 so I suppose it's possible to fix the necronomicom core as well if he has the time/energy .... but it is really only one game and to be fair the MD version is much much much better.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: skins4thewin on September 24, 2017, 05:27 AM
So then, how come my findings and issues are considered unimportant/insignificant and met with resistance, yet a tiny sound imperfection in Outrun was found to be significant enough to be worth addressing?  According to you, this was just a labor of love and that you are under no obligation to do any improvements.....

In all seriousness, I am just wondering why my concerns/findings aren't met with the same response as others?  What did I say or do that was so different from anyone else?  I simply wanted to know what the story was on the volume imbalance between FM and PSG...
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: phoenixdownita on September 27, 2017, 09:34 AM
Addressed?

Where did you get that from?

Also I doubt your bickering helps your cause. If necronomicom says he's fine then the core is done as far as he is concerned, given it was done for free I'd say enjoy it and move on.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on October 09, 2017, 07:15 PM
Hello all,

I have prepared a new test FPGA core for you:

http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=41594430196977865685

It fixes a serious bug in the rhythm note trigger function (which, obviously, has been missed by most people  :P ;) ).

The ryhthm tracks of most games should now sound correctly. Most notorious example is Out Run.

Please note that this is a test core wil limited feature set. Only krikzz can do fully feratured cores.

BR,

Necronomfive

Has testing on this one gone OK, and if so, any word on when this fix will be integrated into a fully featured core? I see 3.04 was officially released on the 12th, so presumably doesn't include this.

Keen to start an FM Phantasy Star playthrough on an official core, but don't want to do so while there are still known bugs in the FM driver.

Bump - @Krikzz, any plans to put this bugfixed core into a Mega Everdrive OS 3.05 update?

I started the Phantasy Star playthrough anyway ;D Absolutely loving the FM!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: KRIKzz on October 16, 2017, 07:51 PM
I just uploaded test build of new os v3.05rc1.  http://krikzz.com/pub/support/var/rc/mega-ed/MEGAOS-V3.05-RC1.zip
Features list:
1)Fixed YM2413. Latest update from Necronomfive
2)Changed controllers detection code
3)Fixed possible micro freeze when exit from Options menu.
4)File sorting option. Folders with more than 256 files will not be sorted
This OS version will resets setting to default, so backup your saves from last played game
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: James-F on October 17, 2017, 02:29 PM
@ Krikzz, is there a way to notify via email when a new firmware is up?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: SmokeMonster on October 17, 2017, 10:01 PM
AWESOME!! Thanks, Krikzz  8)
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: FeverDrive on October 18, 2017, 08:10 AM
I just uploaded test build of new os v3.05rc1.  http://krikzz.com/pub/support/var/rc/mega-ed/MEGAOS-V3.05-RC1.zip
Features list:
1)Fixed YM2413. Latest update from Necronomfive
2)Changed controllers detection code
3)Fixed possible micro freeze when exit from Options menu.
4)File sorting option. Folders with more than 256 files will not be sorted
This OS version will resets setting to default, so backup your saves from last played game
Great news ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on October 19, 2017, 12:12 AM
Wahey! Cheers KRIKzz, will test this out at the weekend.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: JBJBJB on October 19, 2017, 05:00 PM
Sweet!
Now we just need that built-in X7 DAC to be activated so we can listen to those sweet tunes on Genesis 2 / Mega Drive 2 without that nasty distorsion!  ;D
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: CGA Gillian Seed on October 27, 2017, 03:34 AM
Holy heck, going to have to try this out later on! Never got the chance to experience FM music with Master System games before, so this will be something new to me!
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: FBX on November 03, 2017, 03:17 PM
So I tried out the new firmware with the FM core, and while it sounds good, it also sounds at a much lower volume than PCM music. For example on my receiver, I have to turn the knob to 25 in order to get FM to sound about as loud as regular music at a setting of 20. Is there any chance this can be corrected and balanced out?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Alexlotl on November 03, 2017, 03:31 PM
I think Necromfive covered this earlier in the thread - the lower volume is due to hardware limitations (http://"http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=6702.msg52163#msg52163").

Not 100% sure how the cartridge audio pins work, but perhaps it would be possible to amplify this within the Mega Everdrive cart itself, given the addition of a dedicated component to boost the signal.

I don't find it a problem for 100% FM games (just turn up the TV volume), but I'm guessing it would lead to imbalances in the few games that mix FM and PCM (or is it just the Mark III BIOS screen that does this?).
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: PersianImm0rtal on December 04, 2017, 08:27 AM
So if I buy the X5 or the X3 I don't get the FM Master System sound???

I just want to clarify. That sucks if it's only for the X7 because that is a great feature, but it's not worth it when I can buy an X5 or X3 for way cheaper.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: efen3001 on December 14, 2017, 08:49 PM
I´ve ordered an X7 only because the FM feature.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Amerika on December 14, 2017, 09:01 PM
I updated to this over the weekend and I have had zero problems so far!  I freaking love the FM Sound option since a lot of games benefit from it.  And it's crazy to sit there and play a game thinking of what an 8bit system typically sounds like and then, bam, you get that sweet FM Sound.
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: ShadowArtist on February 15, 2018, 01:10 AM
just got an Mega Everdrive X7,  tried playing Phantasy Star (Japanese version with an English re-translation patch) and the FM sound has a little odd sound effects/glitches playing in the title screen.   

Is this due to the early build of the FM sound chip emulation?  and anyone know if an update to improve the FM Sound chip emulation is in the works?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: FeverDrive on February 15, 2018, 03:02 AM
just got an Mega Everdrive X7,  tried playing Phantasy Star (Japanese version with an English re-translation patch) and the FM sound has a little odd sound effects/glitches playing in the title screen.   

Is this due to the early build of the FM sound chip emulation?  and anyone know if an update to improve the FM Sound chip emulation is in the works?
Have you tried using the original japanese rom (no patches)?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: ShadowArtist on February 17, 2018, 12:34 PM
yes.   now what's weird, is that I loaded up the rom of the patched PS 1, and the FM sound is running flawlessly.  it's really odd.

it's like sometimes it will run fine, and sometimes it will run like wild monkey pressing random chip-tune tones...
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: cook99 on April 05, 2018, 10:05 AM
Hey all, curious if anyone has tested the x7 with FM sound on a JVC x-eye console? I've heard x-eye sometimes doesn't play nice for SMS on x7?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Arnold101 on April 15, 2018, 12:17 AM
I think Necromfive covered this earlier in the thread - the lower volume is due to hardware limitations (http://"http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=6702.msg52163#msg52163").

Not 100% sure how the cartridge audio pins work, but perhaps it would be possible to amplify this within the Mega Everdrive cart itself, given the addition of a dedicated component to boost the signal.

I don't find it a problem for 100% FM games (just turn up the TV volume), but I'm guessing it would lead to imbalances in the few games that mix FM and PCM (or is it just the Mark III BIOS screen that does this?).
its the same problem that sd2snes have. and it is fixed with an op amp. can be done the same on the mega ed too please??
@Krikzz a mod is possible?
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: Sylver on April 19, 2018, 08:56 PM
Hi,
I just got my Mega Everdrive X7 to play on my Nomad ... I did the SMS mod on it so I have no problem playing SMS games but when using the YM2413 with some Japanese games that supports it, I simply have no sound ... Are there some additional wires to connect to have a luck to hear FM sound ? I’m a bit disappointed as I mainly ordered a X7 to enjoy this feature !
Edit : Ok there are some additional components and wires to solder :
http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=697.0
Title: Re: Mega Everdrive V2 / X7 FPGA Core - FM Sound for Master System Games
Post by: MaarioS on June 30, 2018, 03:53 PM
Hi,
I just got my Mega Everdrive X7 to play on my Nomad ... I did the SMS mod on it so I have no problem playing SMS games but when using the YM2413 with some Japanese games that supports it, I simply have no sound ... Are there some additional wires to connect to have a luck to hear FM sound ? I’m a bit disappointed as I mainly ordered a X7 to enjoy this feature !
Edit : Ok there are some additional components and wires to solder :
http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=697.0

This is the info you're looking for (taken from another form post):

"I'm not 100% sure what side of the resistors the capacitor is supposed to be on, but it works the way I put in place below.  Pin 1 on the Sega IC 315-5684 chip IS ground, and you connect that to the leg of the capacitor that needs grounding (or any other ground location on the board).  Only the non-grounded leg of the capacitor should make contact with your path between the IC and cart pins.

Pin 24 Sega IC 315-5684 <-----> 47k resistor <-----> .022uf capacitor not grounded leg <----->
Cartridge Connector Pin 1

Pin 10 Sega IC 315-5684 <-----> 47k resistor <-----> .022uf capacitor not grounded leg <-----> Cartridge Connector Pin 3

Any ground location (I used one of the power supply legs) <---> grounded/other leg of .022uf capacitor #1 and capacitor #2

To reiterate from the original instructions: yes you do need to lift the legs of pins 24 and 10 on SEGA IC 315-5684 before you connect the wires or this won't work.  I was able to do this by carefully applying heat with the iron while very gently pulling with an X-acto knife.  In their natural state they are attached to ground, so they have to be not touching ground for them to work properly for the mod."


Other than that, I also have modified my Nomad to play SMS games and FM sound. So far the results are great even on the Nomad!! Even though I have a few original carts, this is just an excellent alternative to play those games just using Everdrive on a portable system, rather than go around with a tower of awful adapters

I also wantd to report some FM sound bugs I discovered so far. I'm not sure whether this is existent only on the Nomad but here is what I noticed:

-in Penguin Land, when the egg crashes, the sound is very loud (not sure if this is what it is supposed to be though)

-in Wonder Boy in Monster Land during Stage Clear and counting down hearts for bonus points, the sound disappears (according to the emulator, it should be just as loud all the time)

Please take a look at those reports. Thanks in advance